I feel for the lost of the family. I do have to ask what was it that shocked the family and does it require GFI protection by code or spec?. Granted I'm no wiz with Artice 680 but I don't think everything associated with a pool is require to be GFCI protected. Negligent Homicide requires the accused acted recklessly that resulted in a death.
I do hope this goes top trial, and all the facts are brought out.
I weary of employers hiring well-meaning folks for low wages, giving them little (or no) training, then calling them "electricians." Just because a guy changes light bulbs doesn't make him an electrician.
I weary of employers who can't be bothered to see that their crews receive real, transferable training. They all seem to want qualified help- yet they won't participate in apprenticeship programs.
I weary of employers saying 'that's too much' when someone asks for appropriate wages. Nope- they seem to think you have a duty to subsidize them, that skilled tradesmen are nothing but retarded chimps with tool belts.
I weary of employers who expect to spend NOTHING on materials, who expect you to scavenge or 'make do.'
Especially, I weary of employers who tell the conscientious employee 'my way or the highway' as they order the guy to hack something together. We don't need no stinking NEC!
It was a pool light, it was not GFCI protected and the electricians, or handy men had worked on the light earlier in the day. Here, as everywhere, you have some skilled and some out right dangerous persons doing work. May times the customer is unaware of who he hires. I know 2 well respected licensed companies here that do dreadful work. How they pass inspections I do not know. One did a large supermarket near this Hotel. THHN wire strung to supply coolers in the lift out ceiling (not in pipe) Covers missing from load centers. Hundreds of 1900 boxes no covers. It passed final. I was there after it opened.(remodel) most was still the same, you just could not see it without a tall ladder and lifting the tiles.
Update, they were electricians working for a electrical contractor. The charge (from the information from the news for what it is worth) is that they failed to install a required protective device (GFCI) that would have prevented the electrocution.
Thanx for the updates. With media theses day, less and less faith I have in any reports. It's more who reports it first and fix the discrepancies later, if at all.
How old was the pool? Did they remove an existing GFCI or just fail to retrofit one.
GFCIs on pool lights have been code for quite a few cycles
Hotel is 40 years old. In 1982 there was a fire there that killed 10 people. The alarms went off and the management turned them off without checking for fire. The lawyers almost beat the fire department.
A regular hotel California...
I question whether the electrician/handyman realized his actions would kill someone. It is sad someone died.
Swimming pool wiring and safety is understood by a low percentage of electricians. Maybe there should be a special license for pool electricians like there is for elevator companies.
Special license? Please ....
Sure, let's take a failed approach (licensing, permits, and inspections) and repeat it. Heck, failure might succeed if you try it often enough!
Alarms turned off? Same owners as today? Management - whether at the hotel or for contractors - sure is quick to assert total authority. How about some liability to go with that?
Special license? Please ....
Sure, let's take a failed approach (licensing, permits, and inspections) and repeat it. Heck, failure might succeed if you try it often enough!
This was actually brought up at the last IAEI chapter meeting here in Tucson, AZ. I will find out more but from what I gathered at the last meeting there will be an additional certification required on your license in order to do pool wiring. There will also be an additional certification for solar installations required. It was only breifly mentioned and I don't even know if it was being proposed only on a local level or at the NEC level. Pools and solar are a pretty big thing here.
There is a series of checks and balances that failed. All the special licenses wouldn't help here. Why didn't the contractor send a competent crew? Where was the quality control from the contractor? What a permit required for the work? Was it inspected? Why didn't the electrician bone up on Article 680 before turning on the power?
Complacency and greed will always trump any credential
Maybe the guys doing the road shows selling CEUs should be including a swimming pool module in their suite of courses and make it a punch you need for license renewal, particularly in places where pools are prevalent.
The basic concepts of pool wiring are not really that complicated. Basically you bond everything and you use a GFCI everywhere. The exceptions are few and it doesn't hurt if you do extra bonding or GFCI things that don't require it.
It sounds like these guys worked on a "broken" pool light and disabled the GFCI to get it going. That seems to be the only thing they could have done to draw a criminal charge.
I still have questions like were they licensed? Were their supervisors charged? I am sure Hilton will be sued.
On the company's website:
"We hire licensed Electricians that have been educated through an electrical trade school. "
They didn't have a permit, but needed one according to the Houston Building Dept. I think the guy that made the decision not to get a permit should be charged right along with the 2.
The family sued both the Hilton, and Brown Electric Inc.
Hilton has the deep pockets, but has no more culpability other than hiring the company in the first place, IMO
Several Hilton hotels are franchises so the local owner, no cooperate would get sued
By the way, a child was swimming in the pool and was being shocked by the defective light, the man that died had jumped in and save the child before he drowned, or was electrocuted.
I bet they find bonding issues too, if it ever gets that far.
Code changes? How about ... we stop putting lights in pools?
Reflections at night might keep you from having a clear view of the bottom? How is that any different from every lake, pond, or stream out there?
They have a lot safer options than a 120v light. 12v lights are common and they also have a fiber optic light with no electricity in the water at all.
What about an inspection? If it was inspected why was the inspector not included in suit/arrests? The lawyers usually go after everyone.
What about an inspection? If it was inspected why was the inspector not included in suit/arrests? The lawyers usually go after everyone.
You have to have a permit to get an inspection.
I am still curious about the scope of this work.
Perhaps Texas is different but a renovation would require a permit here and a simple repair probably would not require bringing the pool up to current code.
As tragic as this was, I think the homicide charge may be an over reach unless we hear something more than I have been able to find on the web.
Pool repairs are subject to permits and inspections here.
That said, not every repair complies with the above.
NJ has an annual mandatory electrical inspection for all pools other than single family resi. It is basically "visual" with GFI testing. The 'visual' on occasion turns up obvious work that was performed, like deck repairs that may have effected the equi bond.
In conjunction with the above, the pools are required to have a bonding certification & test performed every five (5) years.
I do not know the extent of the work or whether a permit was required. If in fact a GFCI was installed, it would have not been able to be reset. If they had worked on the light they would have to install a GFCI in event it was not present. I agree, with the age of LED low voltage lights and fiber optics, line voltage lighting in pools and ponds should be a thing of the past. I would not install one.
The company didn't have a permit, but needed one according to the Houston Building Dept.
The LED bulbs draw 70 watts with the same light output as the 500 watt quartz bulb.
Some have the ability to change colors, and with the right controller, are able to put on light shows in the pool and control low voltage LED landscape lights.
The material cost for new construction is a little over twice as much as the 120 quartz.
BTW, the majority of the pools I refered to do not have any in pool lighting.
I talked to my wife about this, she has 7 commercial pools at the club. She says he health inspector (the guy who inspects pools on an ongoing basis) would have flagged a missing GFCI years ago here.
As I said a few days ago, if these guys removed it, it might be negligent homicide
All we do know is what media choose to report. As always, innocent until proven guilty. If found guilty, throw the book at guilty parties. They all should have known better.
These two guys don't seem particularly bright and I'm struggling to accept that they hold the qualifications required to do this sort of work.
Everybody knows that water and electricity make a deadly combination, but to install equipment like this in a pool with no earth leakage protection, seems like something out of the Twilight Zone.
Irregardless of the fact that no permit was put out for the job or no inspection happened, you can't tell me with a straight face that these guys had no idea that what they were doing was down-right WRONG.
It's just a real shame that a guy lost his life as a result of this.
Word! Early in my career, I have learned, a person who with a journeyman's card means that they supposedly met the time in service and passed a written test. This dont make them electricians.
I coach the engineers in my department to pass the ICC inspector's test and they do on their first try. The tests are simular. Time in service is just letter(s) stating they met the time in service from employers. Someone on this board made a post of, are you an Electrian or an installer. Very good philosiphy. A license does not make you an electrician. Your pears do by proving to them you are one.
Wait... line voltage pool lights are allowed in the US???
Pool lighting has been PELV here in Europe for ages, probably since it became popular!
I agree with sparkyinak: a license does not make a person a capable electrician, no more than a drivers license makes a person a safe driver. Almost anyone can pass a test given enough tries, especially an OPEN BOOK test!
Yeah Tex, you can use 120v lights in a pool but they need to be GFCI protected.
There are times (to numerous, sadly) that I'm amazed at the lack of workmanship & common sense by some in the trade.
Book smart is one thing, but....