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Posted By: pooL8 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/03/11 10:53 AM
Lots of service calls.

They work well enough if you know where not to plug them in.

Posted By: sparky Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/03/11 01:35 PM
doh!
[Linked Image from elite-electric-inc.com]
Posted By: wire_twister Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/03/11 01:58 PM
" But it is just a small heater, it doesent take up much space. How can it use that much electricity?" I had one customer that ran out of propane and decided to heat her house with 7 space heaters running all the time. The following months utility bill was over one thousand dollars, now she has to pay the bill and buy propane.
Posted By: wa2ise Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/03/11 08:37 PM
Friend of my mom's had one of these in the basement. He was moving some stuff around, including the heater. He forgot to unplug it. It got cold in that basement, and the heater turns on, sets fire to the stuff next to the heater, causing a full blown house fire...

I had a couple of these heaters myself, but I threw them out, as I'm a little too mistake prone myself. I did keep the big one that looks like an old fashioned steam radiator. No glowing wire strip in that one.
Posted By: pooL8 Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/04/11 11:23 AM
I worked on a house rewire that was caused by an oil filled heater getting tipped over (radiator lookin kind). It burned the hallway, and oddly enough the fire found the chase that contained about 90% of the circuits.... including the hot tub feed I ran about 6 months before (wasn't me!)

Not sure but I think a dog tipped it over.

Lots of melted plugs like that fine example. Melted wires. Tripping breakers.

I find it odd that most people don't know where their dedicated circuits are. Well they're starting to learn around here!

It's not like the math is hard either.... I can do it!! smile


It's always that neutral wire... see in the picture? Anyone know why? is it those pigtails? whistle (Too many nodes or something, the wires don't like it)
Posted By: gfretwell Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/04/11 04:28 PM
Most (all?) of the new heaters I see have some kind of "tip over" switch that turns off the heater if it is not upright.
The cheap ones are just a rod sticking pout the bottom that needs to be pushed in when it sits on the floor.
Posted By: Texas_Ranger Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/04/11 05:19 PM
WHen I was a kid (maybe 4 years old) we had one of those heaters while we stayed in a weird old house. It was 3-legged (4th one was broken) and when it fell over it blew the fuse, instantly.
Posted By: geoff in UK Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/04/11 08:40 PM
"caused by an oil filled heater getting tipped over (radiator lookin kind)."
That's worrying. I've always thought those the safest type of electric heater. The temperature is thermostatically controlled and presumably there will be an over temperature cut off too. Then the oil is contained in a welded steel case.
Any info on what went wrong?
Posted By: pooL8 Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/04/11 11:32 PM
Sounds like it may have been a different kind of heater. But I saw the burn mark on the rug. Now I'm not sure if it was an oil heater burn mark or not...
Posted By: Obsaleet Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/05/11 04:14 AM
I find outlets like that all the time from the space heaters. I get all sorts of calls from these things. And the always say but the told me it was really efficiant and would save me money. 1250w heater plugged into standard 15a circuit with stab in the back receptacles, the tv and entertainment center some lamps a fish tank and whatever all chugging away, and somehow the circuit breaker is bad and could I come out and change it? LOL

Ob
Posted By: renosteinke Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/05/11 04:43 PM
Space heaters have their role .... and they are frequently abused .... but let's look at another part of the questioon: component ratings.

Let me begin with a colorful example, using footwear. Shoes are shoes, and all are rated for 'walking.' Yet, I wouldn't wear my metatarsal / steel toe boots for dancing, or hike the Applacian trail in heels.

Sounds silly, doesn't it? Yet, we assume all receptacles are equivalent just because they're UL listed. Ditto with switches. Wel, UL has some pretty thorough testing, but you can be sure they don't cycle them on and off of full load for nine months. There are many, many items that wimply won't last very long when pushed to the limit. I mean, ever look inside a power strip, and see just how flimsy those are?

Switches require special attention. Did you realize that the 'usual' light switch has only a 10 amp rating? Look at the markings on the strap.

Receptacles run from 50 cents to 15 dollars .... one would be foolish to assume that all were equally stout.
Posted By: renosteinke Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/05/11 05:06 PM
A separate reply for a separate topic.

Efficient space heating? The advertising is truly shameless. I especially like the ones that imply some sort of magical Amish connection. They ought to fell ashamed.

Others who ought to feel ashamed are the parents and teachers who do such a poor job of educating that folks can reach adulthood and believe this crap. Whether the topic is space heating, 'saving the environment,' or any of a number of public policy topics, the blather that passes for profound thinking is truly frightening. You can't be that stupid on your own; you have to learn it!

Less obvious, but IMO completely scandalous, is the way we quite happily create, or pass on, bad situations to the next guy. "Not my problem" has to be posted on the gates of Hell. Let's be honest here: folks often use space heaters because the heating, insulation, and controls were NEVER adequate. (I'm thinking in particular of apartment buildings where the entire building is controlled by one thermostat in the boiler room).

It's a safe bet that these inadequate designs didn't 'beef up' the electric to allow for the anticipated use of space heaters! No- let's build it as cheap as we can, and pass the consequences of our poor design on to the tenants. Then we can chat with our slumlord friends about how the 'animals' trash the place.

So ... when you see space heaters used, the chances are you r 'problem' goes beyond a toasted receptacle.
Posted By: Texas_Ranger Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/06/11 01:54 PM
The "space heaters are more efficient" fairy tale won't go away as long as unscrupulous vendors and even "electricians" keep claiming that electric heat is 100% efficient because electricity is always fully converted to heat! Heck, even power companies used to market electric heating heavily in Europe, particularly night storage heat in order to level out the load on the grid!

Of course the debate completely ignores the fact that (from an economic point of view) day rate electricity is often more expensive than primary fuels (gas, oil, wood, pellets,..) per kWh and (from an environmental point of view) the losses are simply moved somewhere else, i.e. to the power plant where the electricity is generated and to the transmission lines (heat losses). But hey, juice comes out of the wall, doesn't it?
Posted By: gfretwell Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/06/11 06:40 PM
I live in a place where heat is a minor part of our utility bill so resistive electric heat has been the normal thing. Nobody here has a real "furnace". They just have toaster heater strips in the A/C air handler. Usually it just runs in heat mode less than 100 hours a year. The actual "on" time will be less than that. It is hard to justify a lot of extra expense for another system with that small a usage.
Posted By: Obsaleet Re: 1200W 120v plug-in heaters - 03/06/11 07:03 PM
I usally start with a quick leason in ohms law, and ene with would you plug a window a/c unit in that receptacle? Cause this here heater uses 2x the electric. Some get it soe don't. I believe the effenciencies(sp) come when you turn the main house heat down to 60 and use the space heater in an isolated room.LOL that said" just met with a customer who's heat pump quit and was running on the aux elctric heat for over a month. $900. electric bill. So till it could be replaced she was trying to use space heaters. $800. bill house was cold and she had me there to replace the burned outlet. I told her to turn the heat on and be comfortable. She said but these are energy effciant.lol
She is a nurse and her husband is a doc. 3000sqft plus home.

Ob
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