ECN Forum
Posted By: Retired_Helper Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/09/10 03:25 PM
Here we go again:

CPSC notice link

Here's a thought that may be irrelevant or naive, I know: manufacturers should complain to the publishers and retailers about how-to books with bad instructions that show their product(s).
Posted By: renosteinke Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/09/10 04:35 PM
If you think the DIY books are bad, try taking trade courses at your local community college!

The text and the art are often done by different people. Neither the artist, nor the editor know anything about the topic.

The sad fact is that the publisher relies upon complaints from the customers to do the editing for them. Then, maybe, the errors are corrected in the next edition.

It's unfortunate that folks see something printed as if it were infallable and wise. The simple truth is that anyone can publish everything, and never be held to account for it.

My NEC handbook has artwork that directly contradicts the code text right next to it.

One major publisher (Time-Life) told me that Canada doesn't allow the use of wire nuts - which is news to the Canadians.

Let's not also remember that the internet, according to the media, is a frightfully unreliable source of information.
Posted By: JoeKP Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/09/10 06:59 PM
time for me to go to Lowes with big recalled signs
Posted By: mikethebull Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/10/10 11:46 PM
It amazes me that NEMA or NFPA do not report this to Congress about the unsafe conditions that exist due to the existance of Wir*** 1-2-3 by a certain box store. This is probably the most popular.
Posted By: electure Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/11/10 03:19 PM
These books, although they may be loaded with misinformation, are not illegal.

"U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission, in cooperation with the firm named below, today announced a VOLUNTARY recall"

The NFPA has no control over the content of these books. They are just publishers, publishing their own version of their ideas.





Posted By: NJwirenut Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/11/10 07:22 PM
Originally Posted by electure
These books, although they may be loaded with misinformation, are not illegal.


If the government was powerless to do anything about the infamous "Anarchist's Cookbook", which was packed with recipes for bombs and drugs that were (intentionally?) incorrect and likely to injure/kill the reader if actually used, do you really think that the government is could really pull DIY home wiring books off the market?

And we shouldn't wish it any other way. The First Amendment is a wonderful thing...
Posted By: gfretwell Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/11/10 07:55 PM
Maybe the DIY books should just be relegated to the fiction aisle. wink

I imagine the publishers have a disclaimer in these books that gets them off the legal hook. All they really have to say is "your local codes may vary, check with your building department" or words to that effect.
Posted By: WESTUPLACE Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/12/10 04:02 AM
You don't have to take courses or use DIY books. All the instruction you need is here on this here internet!! And as you all know, all the information on the net is accurate and truthful! You should of heard my sound system before I bought a $90 audio grade receptacle and $15 a ft oxygen free wire fo the speakers. Man what a difference!! i would have never known if I had not read it on the net!!
Posted By: Tesla Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/12/10 10:47 PM
The single most egregious DIY artwork I've seen is Reader's Digest's [ISBN 0-89577-378-3] -- pages 252 & 253:

Repeatedly the switch-leg in Romex is color-banded white.

Illustration #2 shows Romex leaving the box as TWO neutrals, one banded, and popping out as black, white, bare-ground!

This banded-switch-leg notion appears in many other DIY efforts, too. I just don't have them ready-to-hand.

If errors this glaring populate the electricity section one can only fear for those trusting the foundations and framing instructions.

Posted By: Retired_Helper Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/12/10 11:46 PM
Originally Posted by Tesla
The single most egregious DIY artwork I've seen is Reader's Digest's [ISBN 0-89577-378-3] -- pages 252 & 253:

Repeatedly the switch-leg in Romex is color-banded white.

Illustration #2 shows Romex leaving the box as TWO neutrals, one banded, and popping out as black, white, bare-ground!

This banded-switch-leg notion appears in many other DIY efforts, too. I just don't have them ready-to-hand.

If errors this glaring populate the electricity section one can only fear for those trusting the foundations and framing instructions.

The book is advertised by one on-line retailer as, "The most complete and authoritative home repair manual ever published, this book is the yard-stick by which all other books on do-it-yourself are measured. The definitive guide to home repair, maintenance, and improvement. Over 4,000 illustrations."

Well, I'm reassured. crazy
Posted By: Trumpy Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/13/10 08:16 AM
Well,
If you HAVE to read it out of a book, to be able to do something, what does that tell you about the person reading the book?

Practical skills are something you learn by DOING them, not reading them out of some other guys opinion on how they are done.

Otherwise, they'd can the apprenticeship system and give every apprentice a bag full of books and say "See you in 8000 hours time"
Posted By: Retired_Helper Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/13/10 06:54 PM
Periodically, in a big box store, I'll leaf through one of these books for laughs. What limited wiring (and plumbing) that I can do, and do do, I learned from working directly under the supervision of pros. Bottom line: these books can be dangerous and I feel they should not be sold.

Addenda: when writing the above, I first wrote big "bog" store. Freudian slip? smirk
Posted By: mikethebull Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/23/10 06:14 PM
I have found that although it is unfortunate that DIY books are out in big box stores. Usually at some point most customers will realize that there is a time when good old fashioned experience trumps easiness of acessible information. When the book is not giving them an answer. Hopefully, it is before a novice gets killed.
Posted By: HotLine1 Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/24/10 04:24 PM
I just received an (official) email at the office about this. Only 12 days after retired helper posted it here.

Posted By: sbi Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/26/10 08:57 PM
Most of the DIY books come with a small fine print warning in them. I honestly believe that if these books did not say shut the power and check for power. A lot of DIYers would kills themselves.
Also there is no way any book on any trade will be 100% correct. Something is always going to slip by the editors.

When was the last time you guys looked at an License Exam book? Did you count the mistakes in it?
Posted By: Bigplanz Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/27/10 11:35 PM
On the permitting side of things, we review for ‘functional and code compliant’ installations when it comes to DIY projects (homeowner’s permits). As a rule, they might not be pretty, but if they are safe they will be approved. Most DIY projects people get permits for are line extensions in unfinished basements or new additions, either off existing circuits or from new breakers. Most of the ones we see are ok: GFCI where they are supposed to be, EMT on exposed runs on concrete walls, properly supported, in approved boxes, etc. Lots of these people learned how to do these projects from, well, “How to” books and/or talking to friends or, gasp!, from the Internet. They aren’t experts in everything, but if they can put it in, and it passes inspection, more power to them. Many of our homeowner permits are pulled by people who can’t afford an electrician (or a plumber, or a contractor, or a roofer) and they literally are doing it themselves because that’s the only way they can afford it.

What is troubling are the projects done by people who DON’T come in for permits…. Lots of scary installs out there, I imagine, and not much we can do unless the house burns down. I think someone should write a DDIY (Don’t Do It Yourself) book for these specific individuals.
Posted By: Alan Belson Re: Dangerous DIY Instruction Books - 01/27/10 11:46 PM
I just got a fantastic book on 'how to' build traditional American kitchens, [you know, face frame, painted, Colonial, Shaker-style and so on]. And there it is. A half-page pic of a set up on the sawbench, with the 'pressure' [hold-down] shown mounted the wrong way round. Just right to get 20lb of plywood jig and cabinet door smack in the chops! So it ain't all electrical accidents. mad
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