I ran across this today
http://www.flatwireready.com/prod-electrical.htm

They say that it is NEC approved for 120V. You just run it along the wall and then mud over it.
I can't believe that this is approved, never mind considered safe.
What do you think?
Ian

Ian:

I have time (little) to read right now....one thing seems/may be missing.....the all important UL approvals/listing.

Time to read the links and 382.....pending

I saw a pitch in an IAEI meeting and the audience was pretty negative. Be very careful hanging pictures!

It was added in the 2008 code and is required to be listed. See 382.6. They were talking about it on a DIY radio show yesterday. It costs about $200 for the items required for a 10' installation.
Don

It appears just to be pre-advertising for the product. So of build up the hype to where they can sell it, they have buyers already in line. I have never use flat cable but I have seen it before and It has its place in the market. I could see it used in concrete and mason buildings.

I think we should re-title this thread "Appearing soon in violations forum"

I could see it under hardwood floors etc.. (but don't we already have time tested products that will do this....) That mudover idea they show might appeal to the diy crowd and people allergic to drywall cutting, but it's still no good in my book. Done right, it's a dangerously concealed live wire, done wrong, it looks bad because it leaves a visible hump on the wall.

"Southwire is currently working with Underwriters Laboratory (UL) on the certification of the CNE and will make future announcements concerning launch dates and availability. We look forward to UL certification and making FlatWire a unique wiring option."

The Devil is always in the details, it seems.....

"Product FAQ

* What are FlatWire products?

FlatWire Technologies, a division of Southwire, has created a new shift in wiring and interconnect devices for low voltage lighting, audio/loudspeakers, voice/data lines, high performance video, Cat 5, 5e, and 6 data cables, and other low voltage applications. Future products include 120 AC electrical and fiber optics. For specific product specifications, see the individual product group information offered on the website."

Lets hope we see the chapter 11 reoganization announcement first...

Like I tell my kids, don't knock it until you try it.

Flat wire has been used for years in commecrcial applications like in large open office areas. Time will tell. I would be hesitent to use it right out of the gate but it would not stop me from looking at it. I have a saying about old work. "Remodel work shouldn't have to look look remodel work."

I'm in agreement that this will be a Harry Homeowner special right out of the gates. Perhaps they'll price it out of his reach, but rest assured, you'll see it run under carpet, tile and hardwood flooring in no time. Southwire is the principal supplier of cable to the Lowe's chain, so you'll probably see it for sale there before you even see it in your regular supply house.

Let's face it: We all know that the NEC is nothing but a marketing forum for manufacturers to sell their products. Can someone say "AFCI"?

This product is not the same as what has been used as "under carpet flat cable" in the past It is a 5 conductor assembly with the ungrounded conductor in the center, then a grounded conductor on each side of the ungrounded, and an EGC on the outside of each grounded conductor. The supply device must provide both AFCI, GFCI and supplementary overcurrent protection for the flat wire.
Don

This is from last year

It is an easy install, but will leave a good size hole to repair, we used plenty of the flat under floor cable in office buildings, where core holes were not possible due to access problems, and at tht time it was only listed for removable carpet squares, every run had to be topped with a heavy gage sheet metal to protect it from damage, the last job I did was for one of the companies in the trade center after the first attack, so it has been around for a while, John, also installed some on the thornall street high rise, you may run into it on some of your inspections.

Ohhh look, a magnet for picture hooks 'n nails!

A.D

They say it is approved for 120v but I do not see the 120v version, just low voltage, audio and video. No way I would put 120v on anything installed like that, can you spell LAW SUIT

If the stuff is actually that thin, it needs to be fairly wide to carry any serious current. In theory the shape of a conductor shouldn't matter, but with a conductor that thin and wide it just seems like a fire waiting to happen. Besides, if that stuff is just mudded over that doesn't sound like appropriate mechanical protection.
Besides, usually there's a certain isolation thickness required for line voltage cables... I can't see that here.

I guess there's a reason thin film ribbon cables have only been used inside computer equipment for low-current applications.

Add a few nails through the cable that go unnoticed since they don't break the conductor and you're in for a nasty surprise... I guess you should start looking into panel-mount main 30 or 100mA electro-mechanical RCDs for fire safety reasons if that stuff really catches.

Actually IBM used a ribbon power cable for boards in some of the 370 boxes that carried 20-30a but it was at 1.5v or 3v so insulation didn't need to be that tough. They used them so they could lay in the same guides as the flat signal cables.
I suspect these might be the same technology but I still agree physical protection is the biggest issue. I don't even like the idea of using stackers to get a 1.25" horizontal distance from furring strips in a 3/4" furred wall in a hold your nose legal reading of 300.4(D). I thought sleeving romex in EMT (the old Florida rule) made a lot of sense.

You can't drive a nail through this with out tripping the built in GFCI protection. You have to drive it through the EGC and the grounded conductor before you can hit the ungrounded conductor.

Don: (Resqcapt)
If I remember right, from two installs a long while ago....
The FCC (Under carpet tile) Pirelli brand had a sheetmetal protective 'plate' (came in a roll like flashing), and a vinyl base, and vinyl cover for the top. That was $$$$$