I've been working for a retailer for a few years on electrical odd jobs. Most of the time it involves replacing circuit breakers. It is a commercial store front that sells running shoes. Apparently, when it was built the lighting circuitry was designed to turn on/off with breakers only. The breakers are failing regularly and I'm feeling guilty charging him $80 a visit to replace a breaker. One solution would be to install a light switch below the panel and just re-route the wires. Any other suggestions?

Thanks,
Byron

Byron,
Would installing a lighting circuit, without a switch in your area contravene the Code?.
Personally what I would do if the lighting load is that large, is install a contactor in the panel, if there is room and like you said install a Master switch near the Panel.
I've never liked the idea of using a CB as a switch as they are designed to stay closed under normal conditions.
This topic did come up in the Non-US area a wee while back.
It is of my opinion that a CB is only designed as a circuit breaker, not an isolator, the increased operation of the mechanism may cause it an early death.

A circuit breaker that is UL listed as SWD has passed the same test procedures (including mechanical operations)as any standard light switch for tungsten and fluorescent loads. To my knowledge this Switching Duty rating is only available on 1-pole 15 & 20A breakers. There is a similar HID rating on larger ampacities and multi-pole breakers.

Many, if not most, commerical grade breakers (like the SQD QO and C-H CH) are SWD listed.

I just want to qualify what I said above.
I don't think that a CB should be used to break full-load amps un-necessarily that is what switches and contactors are made for.
I like the idea of the contactor because all you then need is a simple control circuit and that the switch only carries the control circuit current.
Contactors also handle inductive load currents a lot better than any switch, as long as they have a certain safety margin applied to them.
Just wanted to clarify my thinking at that idea.

this is standard procedure in my area, no switches just swd rated breakers. Sometimes a dishonest contractor can get away without installing swd breakers. I do not know why though, cost for these breakers is usually close to the same. I have a Dollar store customer with a Cutler Hammer
CH panel with the wrong (non swd rated) breakers in it, so I go every few months and replace a breaker and send a bill for $80.00 I have suggested replacing them all at once, but the management is fine with the service call every so often, so who am I to argue?

I agree with JB, SWD breakers should handle this. If you are just replacing the non-SWD breakers with SWD and the new ones are working OK your customer is in a "pay me now or pay me later" situation.
If new SWDs are failing you have another problem.

According to Square D pubs and UL listing, SWD rated breakers can only switch fluoresent lighting loads. The only other thing I can think of is the ambient temperture in the panel. Breakers stamped with "40 degeees C" indicate that it is rated for continious duty. If it is not stamped "40 degrees C" then the circuit needs derating. Breakers espically lighting panels can get really warm. Even if the air outside the pane may be normal, inside a closed metal box, it can get really warm. If you are switching HID lighting, then the breaker must be HID rated.

I have flipped SWD breakers that were old yet outside of the linkage having a worn feeling to them, there were nothing wrong with them.

A slight example of bad grammar in the UL white book on the meaning of the markings.

What they 'meant' to say was:
"SWD" means that the breakers can switch the worst, most demanding type of lighting that existed at the time: fluorescent. They can switch 'ordinary' lights as well. When lighting companies then went out and made an even worse type of light (HPS, the MH) ... we had to come up with the "HID" rating to cover those. Praise heaven that the latest lighting innovations (cold-cathode, LED, etc) are less demanding than nasty fluorescents and HID's, or we'd have to come up with yet another rating!"

I can't seem to find a part # for SQ D HID QO breakers. Anyone have a link?? I see them mentioned on SQ D page but when I search for them I get nothing

The breakers are not the issue. It is the load applied when repeatedly switching of the lighting load. It is correct that most breakers are suitable for switching, but like any switch, will eventually fail.
I have found that switching on a lighting contactor is the best way to go. If you use just a switch, you will be replacing them as you are the breakers. same service call different device.
Just use a good quality snap switch and have it close the contactor.

If there is nothing wrong electrically, then it all comes down to cost. Ask yourself:

• How often are the breakers needing replacing?

• How many times will it need to be done over the next 10 years?

• What it will it cost over the next ten years?

• What will it cost to re-wire the circuits to switches or a contactor?

For your part number, just HID i.e. QO120HID. I do not think that switching (no pundt intended) to HID breakers will cure your problem. What is the deciding factor that tells you the breakers need replacing? How often are the breakers needing replacing?

Almost every breaker manufactured now is SWD rated (15 & 20A SINGLE pole.. Even the tandem breakers made by Cutler and Sq-D are SWD rated... The only breaker I found without a SWD rating on it is the narrow (1/2") Federal Pioneer style. Their regular (1") version ARE rated SWD..

I agree that using a contactor and a switch is the ultimate way to go, but I think one of the reasons they used the breakers as switches was it was simpler and cheaper to eliminate extra swiches, contactors and the like, and for some applications, it was the ideal method of lighting control.

A.D

A master switch and a contactor to turn all the lights on at once may not be the way to go......at least not in Sacramento, California (where the OP is from).

Individual switches abound because of Part 6, Title 24 (CA's Energy Code). Care must be taken for separate switches to take advantage of daylight areas through windows and skylights, divide everything into 5000 sq ft areas for the purpose of bypassing the required 7-day-programmable-timer for a maximum of 2 hrs...............the list goes on and on.
Lighting controls can become quite complicated in no time at all.

If anything, I'd suggest installing individual switches for each circuit breaker that powers lighting. This will keep the manager/clerks/hired-help out of the panel (I wonder how many times a week they shut off the cash registers or computers mistakenly )

An idle thought .....

I can ALMOST see the sense ... apart from simplicity / economy ... in using the breaker and NOT having a switch to control lights, in some applications.

The first is that HID lights, in particular, do not tolerate a casual flip of the switch.

Them there is the issue of voltage. Or, more correctly, untrained maintenance personnel. When the lights are 277 volt, you don't want the guy trying to use a 50 cent household switch ... or changing ballasts 'hot.'

Reno:
Ya I never thought of it in that way but I was thinking of how they wired my elementary and high school classrooms.. Each room had a 4 or 6 circuit panel and located where the light switches normally would be..This fed and controlled the lights obviously but also supplied the receptacle circuit(s) and exhaust fan. ( we had no such thing as A/C!..
This kept all the switching grouped nicely and also allowed the overcurrent protection to be right there in the room.. Was no need whatsoever to call the caretaker when them pesky overhead projector bulbs blew out and tripped the breaker at the same time... Also the feed to each room was no more than 30A from what I can remember so 3#10's in a piece of 1/2 would have been easy to install and cheap.
Electure: Yes I have seen where clerks / hired help / staff etc have shut off the wrong breaker and shut down something by mistake.. Happened at the community center my G/F works at but the addition of breaker " lock-dogs" solve that problem ( and so does a correct panel legend so ya know what breaker to take the lock dog off and reset

A.D

Use common sense and a calculator to decide HOW many contactor's you need. I was not saying to put all the lights in a grocery store on the same contactor. A common lighting contactor has two poles. You can light two circuits with it. if you need more, then add more. The protection is at the breaker, not the contactor. Contactors are dirt cheap these days. Material will not be the issue, only labor. If you mount an enclosure right next to the main panel for the contactors it should be a very reasonable proposition to the store owner.
I think it is important to keep store personnel out of panels anyway.

Yeah, mate,
That was what I was thinking when I made the comment above.
I didn't mean one switch/contactor = whole lighting installation.

It's permissible to use the breaker as the functional switch under British "code," but pretty rare in my experience.

Even if the main light switching point is right at the distribution panel, it's normal to fit a bank of regular switches for control alongside.

Trumpy.....No problem. We are both on the same page now.....John

Here it's pretty common... and the breakers usually don't take it that well - at some point they just refuse to stay closed.Since they always seem to blow open (mechanical failure) I'm not that worried about it.

How can you change a breaker for $80.00?