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#98109 - 05/04/06 02:39 AM NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
aldav53  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 545
Chandler, AZ USA
Are there any places at all where NM can be run in Commercial Bldgs? I looked it up but not sure where if at all they are saying you can. I never have never seen it run.


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#98110 - 05/04/06 06:30 AM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
Forgetting local amendments and customs the NEC does not prohibit the use of NM in commercial spaces. It does prohibit NM from the space above a suspended ceiling in a non-dwelling unit.

The NEC limits the use of NM by building type. That is the type of construction not by the use of the building. (For the most part)

Here in my area you will find many commercial buildings wired with NM. It is used for 480 as well as 120.

We also have a local amendment which allows the use of NM above the suspended ceiling of non-dwelling units.

[This message has been edited by iwire (edited 05-04-2006).]


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts

#98111 - 05/04/06 11:14 AM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
aldav53  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 545
Chandler, AZ USA
So you can use it in any commercial building except for above a drop ceiling? Why wouldn't more contractors use NM then?


The Golden Rule - "The man with the gold makes the rule"

#98112 - 05/04/06 12:40 PM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
walrus  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 680
Bangor Me. USA
I see it everywhere I go in the C store world, last code update class I had the head State inspector was allowing it above suspended ceilings also. Not sure if the they amended the code or he just allows though??


#98113 - 05/04/06 05:38 PM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
Ryan_J  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
West Jordan, Utah, USA
No, you can use it in buildings that are type III, IV or V construction. You can't use it in type I or II.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

#98114 - 05/04/06 06:41 PM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
trekkie76  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 220
baileyville, maine, usa
walrus, there was a state amendment to that part of 334 to allow the use of NM above a dropped ceiling


#98115 - 05/04/06 07:23 PM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,489
Michigan USA
Ryan- You are right about the Class I & II Construction if you use the '05 code but under the '02 you could use it in Class I & II construction because it was not specifically prohibited in the '02.

[This message has been edited by George Little (edited 05-04-2006).]


George Little

#98116 - 05/05/06 09:20 AM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
Ryan_J  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
West Jordan, Utah, USA
George, I'm not following you. Type of construction was a change to the 2002 NEC, not the 2005.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

#98117 - 05/05/06 03:44 PM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,489
Michigan USA
Ryan- You are correct in that the type of construction wording came in in the '02. BUT- The wording only said that Class III, IV and V construction permitted NM cable with no floor limitation. This was challenged at our State Appeal board and it was decided that since it was not shown as "Uses not Permitted" that it would be allowed in all types of construction. In the '05 code they nailed it by the wording in 334.12(A)(1). Jeff Sargent and a few other noteables were involved with the State decision. I think the code panel goofed in '02 and they corrected it in '05. The problem is making a "Uses Permitted" all inclusive and there in lies the loop hole.
I don't know if you knew it or not but Michigan has for at least 25 years allowed NM cable with no limitations on structure type or floor height. There track record is in tact and they are not burning down any high rise buildings due to NM cable. So until they see a convincing arguement to disallow NM cable, we will be using it by amending out wording that would prohibit it's use.

D** Typo's

[This message has been edited by George Little (edited 05-05-2006).]


George Little

#98118 - 05/05/06 08:33 PM Re: NM in Commercial Bldgs.  
aldav53  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 545
Chandler, AZ USA
How is type lll, lV, or V different than l or ll.


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