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GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92516
03/21/05 04:07 PM
03/21/05 04:07 PM
H
homersimpson  Offline OP
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 4
Attleboro, MA, USA
I was wondering if anyone has heard of people using GFI outlets mounted near the panel to supply circuits requiring a GFI breaker. I would like to know if this is a common practice among penny pinching hacks, or just urban legend.

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92517
03/21/05 04:55 PM
03/21/05 04:55 PM
A
Active 1  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 687
Grayslake IL, USA
I seen several GFI's mounted below the panel for this. Many locals have a rule the GFI rec can only be load sided for that room.

A number of homes built when the GFI's first came out had 1 working everything, kitchen, baths, garage, basement, and garage. They pipe and pulled them all together.

Tom

Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92518
03/21/05 05:24 PM
03/21/05 05:24 PM
R
resqcapt19  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
IL
What circuits require a GFCI breaker? I can think of one that requires a GFCI receptacle, but can't think of any that require a GFCI breaker.
Don


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92519
03/21/05 05:34 PM
03/21/05 05:34 PM
HotLine1  Online Content

Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,094
Brick, NJ USA
The 'type' of GFI protection installed is a 'design' issue, not a NEC issue.
GFI can be the device (GFI Recept), a GFI CB, or a 'faceless' GFI.

John


John
Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92520
03/21/05 05:53 PM
03/21/05 05:53 PM
G
George Little  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,498
Michigan USA
Well if you'll allow me to digress from the GFCI issue, the code requires Ground Fault protection for Fixed Outdoor Electric Deicing and Snow Melting that is seen as a possible location for a GFCI receptacle. This should be a circuit that is protected by a breaker and can not be substituted by a a receptacle. In fact the breaker is the only device available for this type of installation. The GFPE has a trip level od 30-50 ma as I recall and the GFCI has a trip level of 4-6ma.


George Little
Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92521
03/21/05 06:38 PM
03/21/05 06:38 PM
R
Roger  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
N.C.
I agree with Don, I know of requirements (5 to be exact) for a GFCI receptacle, but not for full circuit protection.

This may not be what Don is refering to.

Roger

Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92522
03/21/05 07:28 PM
03/21/05 07:28 PM
H
HLCbuild  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 209
Herndon,Va USA
Once again, I'm in the '99 NEC but the requirements here are to be GFCI protected. It doesn't specify as to how to do this. Either a breaker or a receptacle. I prefer to use GFCI receptacles so my customers don't have to wander to the basement or garage to reset a GFCI breaker that trips when they are ready to dry their hair having just stepped out of the shower. That said, it is the choice of the designer.

Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92523
03/21/05 08:26 PM
03/21/05 08:26 PM
I
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
If you provide GFI protection for the small appliance branch circuits with a GFCI receptacle at the panel you would have a violation. [Linked Image]

Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92524
03/21/05 08:50 PM
03/21/05 08:50 PM
C
CTwireman  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 840
Connecticut, USA
Quote
If you provide GFI protection for the small appliance branch circuits with a GFCI receptacle at the panel you would have a violation.
Bob



Unless you used dead front GFCIs. Why anyone would do this is unknown to me. I have never seen it.

Peter D.


Peter
Re: GFI outlet in place of GFI breaker? #92525
03/21/05 09:07 PM
03/21/05 09:07 PM
I
iwire  Offline
Moderator
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
North Attleboro, MA USA
Peter

by Pete;
Quote
Unless you used dead front GFCIs.


By me;
Quote
If you provide GFI protection for the small appliance branch circuits with a GFCI receptacle at the panel you would have a violation.
Bob



It's all in the details. [Linked Image] [Linked Image]

Quote
Why anyone would do this is unknown to me.


It is a solution if you wanted GFI protection from a fuse or obsolete CB panel.

Why not use a GFCI receptacle at the point of use?

Have you tried to install a GFCI receptacle in an old box? [Linked Image]

Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
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