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Outlet? #89809 10/20/04 06:05 AM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,507
G
George Little Offline OP
Member
The definition of an "outlet" in the code is somewhat controversial IMHO. There are those who would say a receptacle or a lighting fixture box are outlets. Others will say any box that contains a neutral is considered an outlet. So, one could say a switch located in a bedroom that controls a flood light outside the house is an outlet and requires AFCI. What say you?


George Little
2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: Outlet? #89810 10/20/04 06:08 AM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
R
resqcapt19 Offline
Member
In my opinion, it is not an outlet unless it directly supplies some type of equipment. The switch is not an outlet.
Don


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Outlet? #89811 10/20/04 06:24 AM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 613
S
shortcircuit Offline
Member
An outlet is something that uses power.A switch only controls the power.So I would say that the switch that controls a flood light outside of a bedroom need not be AFCI protected.

shortcircuit

Re: Outlet? #89812 10/20/04 07:02 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 849
Y
Yoopersup Offline
Member
Definations answers your Question. Both switch and oulet are in there. Out (A point on the wiring System at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.)A switch is not utilization equipment.

Re: Outlet? #89813 10/20/04 12:34 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
E
ElectricAL Offline
Member
In my opinion, there are four key definitions in Article 100 that interlock into a whole, with respect to your question, George.
  • Premises Wiring (System) - branch circuit in the walls
  • Controller - light switch
  • Outlet
  • Utilization Equipment - flood light
We are told that the current path internal to a controller is not part of the Premises Wiring. Current has to be taken from the Premises Wiring for it to flow in the Controller.

When the controller allows an equipment (flood light) to utilize energy, the current for the utilization equipment must be taken from the premises wiring system, routed through the controller, returned to the premises wiring system and be taken again at the flood light.

In my opinion, a light switch is installed at an outlet.


Al Hildenbrand
Re: Outlet? #89814 10/20/04 01:05 PM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
R
resqcapt19 Offline
Member
Al,
Quote
We are told that the current path internal to a controller is not part of the Premises Wiring. Current has to be taken from the Premises Wiring for it to flow in the Controller.
The controller (switch) does not use the current and is not ultilization equipment, therefore it is not installed at an outlet.
Don


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Outlet? #89815 10/20/04 01:33 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
E
ElectricAL Offline
Member
Don,
Quote
resqcapt19 wrote: In my opinion, it is not an outlet unless it directly supplies some type of equipment.
The NEC does not use the language directly supplies.

The current only has to be taken from the wiring system and be current that is to supply utilization equipment. I see nothing in the definition of Outlet that limits "A" point to being "The only" point.


Al Hildenbrand
Re: Outlet? #89816 10/20/04 03:41 PM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,148
R
resqcapt19 Offline
Member
Al,
You read it your way and I'll read it mine. I will never change my opinion on this issue unless the NFPA issues a formal interpretation saying that I am wrong. We spent 11 pages on this issue on Mike Holt's forum and it was not resolved.
Don


Don(resqcapt19)
Re: Outlet? #89817 10/20/04 04:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
E
ElectricAL Offline
Member
Yup. [Linked Image]

Don, we have two different readings.

I join you, George Little, in asking, "What say you?" to the rest of the community.

The meaning of Outlet is the heart of the question, seems to me, not whether a switch utilizes energy.


Al Hildenbrand
Re: Outlet? #89818 10/20/04 04:33 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,374
R
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator
I share Don's opinion, personally.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
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