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#88427 06/01/04 08:34 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
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Member
[Linked Image]

I've got a landscaper that is hot to install a fountain outdoors in a yard that looks like the fountain shown in the photo.

The pump is inside a sump well that is a heavy plastic with a removable lid. The sump well is about 18" across and 24" deep. The stone "fingers" are about 4" long, 1" wide, and 2-3" up and down.

The pump is 120 volt with a 16 foot cord. I suggested laying the cord in a slot between the stone fingers. The landscaper, of course, doesn't want to see the cord or a slot at all.

400.8 has me stumped.

Any creative, compliant solutions? ?

ElectricAL


Al Hildenbrand
2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
#88428 06/01/04 09:32 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
T
Member
Did you consider a submersible junction box?
http://www.georgia-fountain.com/gefco/ee105.pdf

[This message has been edited by txsparky (edited 06-01-2004).]


Donnie
#88429 06/01/04 09:34 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,527
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Moderator
Looks like Part F of NEC Article 680 is worth reviewing. Is the {submersible?} pump assembly listed or labeled? Sixteen feet seems quite long except for a vacuum cleaner or drop light.

There may be some allowance for treating it similar to a wet-niche light fixture.




[This message has been edited by Bjarney (edited 06-01-2004).]

#88430 06/01/04 09:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,035
Likes: 1
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Al,

I'm not clear on where the pump itself is, but can it somehow be located some distance away in a conveniently "out of sight" location?

That way there would just be water piping going to this thing which could be buried and out of sight.

Bill

[This message has been edited by Bill Addiss (edited 06-01-2004).]


Bill
#88431 06/01/04 10:12 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
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Donnie,

Interesting. . .hadn't thought about cutting the cord cap off. There's probably a listing issue around that for the pump.

Bill,

The current idea is to place the pump in the sump. The sump is in the center of the "stone flower". The center two concentric rings of stone fingers rest on the sump lid and come up with it.

Bjarney,
Quote
680.51(E) Wiring. Equipment shall be equipped with provisions for threaded conduit entries or be provided with a suitable flexible cord. The maximum length of exposed cord in the fountain shall be limited to 3.0 m (10 ft). Cords extending beyond the fountain perimeter shall be enclosed in approved wiring enclosures. Metal parts of equipment in contact with water shall be of brass or other approved corrosion-resistant metal.
Given that the sump is only 18" across, there will be less than 10' of cord in the fountain. . .As I read this, there is no max length limit outside of the fountain.

My question. . .What is an approved wiring enclosure, that isn't a raceway? 400.8(6)

[This message has been edited by ElectricAL (edited 06-01-2004).]


Al Hildenbrand
#88432 06/03/04 06:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 751
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Member
90.3 allows article 680 to "supplement or modify" the first 4 chapters.

Which allows us to run cords to wet-niche lighting, fountain lights and pumps in conduit.

Earl


Earl
#88433 06/03/04 07:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
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Member
That's a revelation to me. [Linked Image] So, if I size a PVC conduit large enough to slide the pump cord and cord cap through, and the pump is used for a fountain, that is, Chapter 6 Special Equipment, then the raceway can become an approved enclosure.

Cool!

After the cord is in, I could plug the male adapters, or bell ends, with duct seal, thus allowing ready removal, and run the PVC from the shrubs at the edge of the stone to the edge of the sump.


Al Hildenbrand
#88434 06/03/04 07:35 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 886
H
Member
So, if I size a PVC conduit large enough to slide the pump cord and cord cap through, and the pump is used for a fountain, that is, Chapter 6 Special Equipment, then the raceway can become an approved enclosure.

Hey, I suggested that the other night, was like the second reply and for some reason it's not here now. [Linked Image]

-Hal

Ahh, I found it. [Linked Image]
http://www.mikeholt.com/codeforum/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=003762

[This message has been edited by hbiss (edited 06-03-2004).]

[This message has been edited by hbiss (edited 06-03-2004).]

[This message has been edited by hbiss (edited 06-03-2004).]

#88435 06/03/04 11:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
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Member
Hal,

Thanks for your earlier suggestion. The thing I wasn't understanding was what Earl pointed out. I was hung up on an un-modified 400.8(6). Some of the scales have fallen from my eyes. [Linked Image]


Al Hildenbrand
#88436 06/04/04 09:01 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 751
E
Member
That's what we are all here for....Now, for some of the scales from my eyes....??

Earl


Earl
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