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#87042 01/16/04 08:27 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
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Ryan_J Offline OP
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Would you ask for GFCI protection for the area on the left (foreground)?

[Linked Image]


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
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#87043 01/16/04 08:59 PM
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 806
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Member
If I were homeowner--absolutely.

If I were AHJ--nope. It might be a good idea, but I don't think the NEC requires it here. Too far from the sink.

#87044 01/16/04 09:31 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 269
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Member
210.8(A)(6)specifies GFCI in kitchens where receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces. Is this a countertop surface? Since "countertop surface" is not defined, could you call it a work surface or something else? Is this a part of the kitchen? Food for thought here.


John
#87045 01/16/04 09:50 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
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Ryan_J Offline OP
Moderator
Wirenut: Where in 21.8 is proximity to the sink addressed?

Electircman: Food for thought indeed. Thats why I posted it [Linked Image]

I think we can get some good conversation here.

BTW: Where does the kitchen end? Is it the passageway on the left? Is it the transition from the hardwood floor to the carpet?

Let me add that the material is the same as the countertop near the sink.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
#87046 01/16/04 09:56 PM
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 333
S
Member
Ryan, it looks like a "desktop" to me.


Steve
#87047 01/16/04 09:59 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
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Ryan_J Offline OP
Moderator
Stamcon: I have no problem with your interpretation, but would the judge and jury have a problem with it if someone got killed? A human death is what got the requirement in commercial kitchens, as you know.


Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City
#87048 01/16/04 10:26 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 269
E
Member
Quote by Ryan
Quote
I think we can get some good conversation here.
Like the firehouse kitchen thread, huh? [Linked Image]


John
#87049 01/16/04 10:37 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,116
Likes: 4
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Ryan,

What do the Plans say that room is?

[Linked Image]
Bill


Bill
#87050 01/16/04 10:41 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,716
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Member
Here's my take on this. If there is no code that would define a line (real or imaginary)
to separate this area from the kitchen, then by the open space alone, I'd consider it an extension of the kitchen by design.

Roger

#87051 01/16/04 11:01 PM
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 333
S
Member
Ryan, when the '99NEC specifies GFCI's on receptacles serving residential kitchen
"countertops" and not all kitchen receptacles, where do we draw the line for safety? Why not all receptacles in the house be GFCI and AFCI? When the NEC considers the kitchen, pantry, breakfast room and dining room as different rooms(small appliance circuits), who makes the call as to what the room is? What's stated on the plans?

steve


Steve
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