ECN Forum Forums Code Related Discussion NEC & other Code issues 200 Ampere Wire in Commercial Work

Virgil,
it's just as bad here....
to be torn bettween trade ethics and being competitive is not a position i enjoy.

I'm starting to think this could only occur as a grassroot endevor....

Sparky, yes, no denying that moguls are pricy! Perhaps LB's should have been substituted by pull boxes instead..although there were probably job factors that precluded that choice. As for lead time, I'd bet that there would be a lot of older electricians that would like to rave about the newer "minimal inventory" management methods of wholesale houses which began about 15 years ago.
Sparky66wv, don't know how the distance is measured..just being the Devil's advocate here. I haven't seen an inspector yet who gave more than a quick glance at the sizes of condulets and shape of the covers.. I'm using this site to probe a little..to see how things are done outside of Oregon.

Elzappr - Sparky,

Your comments of being bite 15 years down the road - .

I would like to see some court rulings on disasters that were caused by poor wiring installations. What few I see in newspapers or magazines seem to be settled out-of-court so that no outsider knows what was the outcome.

In my estimation, many wiring shortcomings would not showup for several years, such as
derating of 310-15(b).

Just a three weeks ago, I saw where 30 volt landscaping 2/C was installed in a 120V chandelier fixture made by a prominate fixture manufacture which makes listed and unlisted fixtures. Did not see a listing make on this un-assembled chandelier.
That 30V 2/C wire would probably lasted several years before a break-down and then the owner would probably want it replaced/repaired so quickley, that no-one whould check why the fixture went bad, JUST GET IT REPLACED !!!!

Virgil,
Sorry, I shouldn't have mentioned that here. I was trying to offer something that might explain why the Inspector might have the viewpoint that he does. I was also picturing a very short run.

Can you still order a 150A main ?

Bill

Virgil,

Don't lose any sleep. See 240-3(b). I myself would have opted for 3/0 copper or 250 alum, but done is done & I don't see much of a problem here. There was a time, not that long ago, when Allegheny Power did require 250 mcm Aluminum on non-residential 200 amp services.

Also, I know you're smart enough to use an LB that is marked with the maximum size of conductor allowed so that you don't have to worry about 314.28(A)(2) exception because you're in compliance with 314.28(A)(3)

Here in the Mountain State, we should probably hold off using the 2002 NEC for at least another 5 or 6 years.

Tom

[This message has been edited by Tom (edited 01-07-2002).]

Sounds like a good semi-escape route, Tom, but for the issue of conduit fill. I'm not sure, but I think C10 lets you know that 2" PVC is maxed out by the 4/0. So 314.28(a)(3) doesn't apply (or, using '99 Code, 370-28(a)(3)). The reason why I'm saying I'm 'not sure' is that the tri-rated "new stuff" cable Virgil used isn't listed in C10..but for 'RHW-2',and THAT insulation would only allow TWO 4/0 conductors in 2"PVC. If the conduit wasn't maxed out, then it would be cool..per your comments..except for the confused inspector call that permitted 4/0 in the first place.

If Virgil's cable is without the outer covering, he is OK all the way. See the little asterisk at the bottom of C10. I'm not sure either.

Also, those tables assume all conductors are the same size. Virgil is using a 2/0 neutral. If you look up the dimensions of RHW-2 in table 5 & add everything up, the area comes to 1.2913 inches & the maximum permitted is 1.316 (table 4) Things get even better if you look up the RHW-2 with the asterisk.


One thing that I do know is that XLPE isn't a listing. It stands for cross linked polyethylene & this is the main ingredient of some of the thermoset insulations.
Tom

It looks even better with compact conductors..but we don't have that info to go on.

No outer sheath, and I think it is compact wire...

Something about "compact building wire" written on the insulation...

It's very soft and flexible in comparison to THHN or the old USE...

It's catalogued as "Mobile Home Cable" at the local supplier...

"WMOBLE4/04" is the catalogue #...

Am I clear as mud yet?