ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
Shout Box
Recent Posts
High current GFI vs regular GFCI
by HotLine1. 11/16/18 01:03 PM
This anti-theist is priceless!!!
by djk. 11/14/18 07:19 AM
Single phase and what you call it.
by dsk. 11/12/18 11:10 AM
220/230/240V 60Hz Systems
by Albert. 11/07/18 12:48 AM
New in the Gallery:
What is this for?
Plug terminals
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 24 guests, and 24 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
240.24(B), et al #78984
11/16/01 08:04 AM
11/16/01 08:04 AM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,276
Fullerton, CA USA
I go regularly to buildings where the electrical rooms are kept locked, and the tenants don't have a key (both multi and single tenants). It's not unusual to have to drive 5 or 10 miles to pick up a key from the management company.
Although this is a pain in the neck, my concern is more with the tenant not being able to shut off the power in the event of an emergency.
I don't think that this constitutes "ready access", and the tenants should be able to get in the rooms immediately on a 24-7 basis.
What do you think???

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: 240.24(B), et al #78985
11/16/01 09:36 AM
11/16/01 09:36 AM
S
spkjpr  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 218
Sedalia,MO, USA
I agree with you on the ready access. Seems that a building supt should have one or there should be some means to provide a key. Can also see why the tenants don't have access due to vandalism, etc, though.

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78986
11/16/01 12:11 PM
11/16/01 12:11 PM
M
motor-T  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 280
Girard, Ohio, USA
electure;
I agree these duplexes need acccess to the service panels. A lot of times these Landlords take an old single home and convert them to two apartments and the only access is through the downstairs appartment.
Our inspectors always insists that the tenants have access to their panels.
I had a service call where the LL called and said that one of her tenants didnt have power, when I got there, there were 3 meters outside,one of them had a yellow tag meaning a disconnect, one was for the house panel the other two for the two apartments, the POCO had shut one of the tenants power off but half of her apartment was on the house meter some of these places are accidents waiting to happen and the only access to the three panels was through the downstairs appartment.

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78987
11/16/01 01:04 PM
11/16/01 01:04 PM
P
pauluk  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
I see the landlord's point of view, but for safety's sake I feel that there must be easy access to shut off power in an emergency.

I had a demonstration of this sort of thing years ago at a girlfriend's house.
This was a general store with apartment above, and all the main switchgear was down in the shop. Said girlfriend's younger sister started to run a bath, then went off in the car taking all the shop keys with her. When we realized something was wrong, water had already flooded the hallway and was cascading through lights and fittings in the hallway below giving an ample demonstration of why water and electricity don't mix too well. I had to smash the window in the shop door to get to the main switch.

Younger sister was not too popular with Mom and Dad that night!

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78988
11/16/01 05:35 PM
11/16/01 05:35 PM
S
sparky  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,371
Is there a Fireman here that will comment??

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78989
11/16/01 07:09 PM
11/16/01 07:09 PM
electure  Offline
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 4,276
Fullerton, CA USA
I should have mentioned that these aren't duplexes or houses, but large commercial buildings with services of up to 2000 or 3000 amps of 480V power.
They contain many more possible sources of trouble, and the trouble could be of a much greater magnitude. (I've actually taken to telling tenants how to open Utility Co. and Fire Dept lockboxes with the tire irons from their cars for emergency access to keys).
Any complaints to Mgmt Co's, even with Code references, have had the same result. They deem their 9-5 M-F remote location as "ready access" [Linked Image]

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78990
11/17/01 07:21 AM
11/17/01 07:21 AM
S
sparky  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,371
Scott,
does your area use knox-boxes?

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78991
11/17/01 12:05 PM
11/17/01 12:05 PM
N
Nick  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 599
Riverside, CA
Knox-boxes are pretty common out here in SO CA.

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78992
11/17/01 01:14 PM
11/17/01 01:14 PM
S
sparky  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,371
well,
911 would mitigate any entry problems.

Re: 240.24(B), et al #78993
11/17/01 02:27 PM
11/17/01 02:27 PM
M
motor-T  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 280
Girard, Ohio, USA
Sparky:
Exccuse my ignorance but what is a ' Knox-box'?

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Featured:

2017 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2017 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
BEAMEUP
BEAMEUP
WA
Posts: 27
Joined: December 2004
Show All Member Profiles 
Top Posters(30 Days)
Admin 8
Popular Topics(Views)
251,513 Are you busy
188,688 Re: Forum
178,391 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1
(Release build 20180101)
Page Time: 0.034s Queries: 15 (0.005s) Memory: 1.0239 MB (Peak: 1.1978 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2018-11-16 18:47:57 UTC