ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat
Recent Posts
A 5-20(20a) receptacle is legal on a 15a circuit?
by libellis - 10/10/21 12:46 PM
GFCI's pops in large numbers
by dsk - 10/07/21 03:46 PM
Backup Generator Done Right
by timmp - 10/06/21 02:07 PM
How's all our Non-US folks doing?
by dsk - 09/30/21 05:06 AM
Well I am back to stay (nearly 6 years)
by Bill Addiss - 09/26/21 11:09 PM
New in the Gallery:
240/208 to a house
240/208 to a house
by wa2ise, October 9
Now you know.
Now you know.
by Tom_Horne, September 7
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 8 guests, and 20 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 613
S
Member
I was at the home show in Bawstin today and there were a couple of landscape lighting company's pushing there products, low voltage landscape lighting.

He said that he is not required to have a electricians licence to do this work of installing these systems.

I argued that he did.

Who was right?

shortcircuit

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 681
P
Member
It depends on the local jurisdiction.
Our jurisdiction allows non-licensed installers to install the low voltage lighting (still requires a permit for inspection), if it is hard wired for the line side of the transformer, they have to hire a licensed electrical contractor for that portion of the installation.


Pierre Belarge
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 886
H
Member
We had a heated debate with one of those manufacturers on this subject in this forum (I think) many months back. Seems that because it is low voltage manufacturers think that no codes apply and there also is no safety issue.

Although the NEC sections are minimal, 300.5 gives the minimum cover requirement for buried landscape lighting cable and 411.1 gives the equirements for lighting systems 30 volts or less, these are code requirements.

To answer your question, I think it would be up to the AHJ's in each area as to how they want to deal with this issue. I think I vaguely remember some area requiring landscapers to take a short course and pass a test on these areas which would then allow them to install the lighting.

-Hal

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
E
Member
Reading through the Mass Gen laws I don't see a clear answer. I might tend to agree with him on the assumption that he looked into it before he started this part of his business. I really don't see the need for a license to do this.

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,233
H
Member
Here in NJ I believe that anyone can install low voltage lights if the transformer plugs in. A permit is required if the install is new.

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
I
Moderator
Shortcircuit knowing you are a fellow MA resident I agree with you.

Quote
GENERAL LAWS OF MASSACHUSETTS
PART I.
ADMINISTRATION OF THE GOVERNMENT

TITLE XX.
PUBLIC SAFETY AND GOOD ORDER

CHAPTER 141. SUPERVISION OF ELECTRICIANS

Chapter 141: Section 1A Licensure requirement; exceptions

Section 1A. No person, firm or corporation shall enter into, engage in, or work at the business or occupation of installing wires, conduits, apparatus, devices, fixtures, or other appliances for carrying or using electricity for light, heat, power, fire warning or security system purposes, unless such person, firm or corporation shall be licensed by the state examiners of electricians in accordance with this chapter and, with respect to security systems, unless such person, firm or corporation shall also be licensed by the commissioner of public safety in accordance with the provisions of sections fifty-seven to sixty-one, inclusive, of chapter one hundred and forty-seven.

This chapter shall not apply to: a person not engaged in the business described in this section who employs or contracts for the services of a person, firm or corporation engaged in such business; or to an apprentice employed by a person, firm or corporation licensed in accordance with this chapter; or to an agent, employee or assistant of a person, firm or corporation licensed in accordance with this chapter who does not engage in or perform the actual work described in this section.

http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/141-1a.htm

Thats what I believe the law says, what really happens is another story.

Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,457
E
Member
After Bob's post and reading alittle more it looks like a license in needed. Does not seem necessary to me.

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 206
C
Member
Shortcircuit & iwire here in Ma it is legal for a homeowner to pull a permit to install these lights. So the landscaper has the HO pull a permit and he rides off into the sunset with a big wad of cash in his pocket. Just another thing about this state I do not care for.

Al

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
I
Moderator
Hi Al I agree that can be one way, I think most times they just do not pull a permit in the first place.

Of course that never happens... [Linked Image]

Bob


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 613
S
Member
I can see the occasional landscaper installing some lights and getting away with it,(like going 60 in a 55mph zone)but these guys are engaged in the business of installing these lighting systems for "HIRE" and they are not licensed to do so [Linked Image]

You see the key word here in Massachusetts is for "HIRE"(section 3L)...this is what allows homeowners to do there own work.

shortcircuit

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard
Featured:

Tools for Electricians
Tools for Electricians
 

* * * * * * *

2020 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2020 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
pcsailor
pcsailor
Minneapolis, MN, USA
Posts: 21
Joined: September 2019
Top Posters(30 Days)
dsk 5
Popular Topics(Views)
284,570 Are you busy
217,281 Re: Forum
203,631 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5