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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 11
C
Chester Offline OP
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Attic Rat, "do it right or don't do it at all" is the very reason I am here asking these questions. I would hope I have made this abundantly clear.

[This message has been edited by Chester (edited 04-25-2004).]

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 524
Member
... Clear as driven snow,...I was just being redundant..No worries dude,.. [Linked Image] [Linked Image]


.."if it ain't fixed,don't break it...call a Licensed Electrician"
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,438
Member
[Linked Image from safetycenter.navy.mil]

Might wanna check the contacts on that dryer outlet! [Linked Image]

-Randy

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 939
F
Member
[Linked Image] [Linked Image] that is ugly one there . for some other peoples want to know why i did talk about that with air compressor [see my area about the air compressor hook up ]

that one reason why for " soft molded plugs" are curpits with connetions and they are common found in window a/c usage but diffrent plug arrangements but same result when they get hot.

merci, marc


Pas de problme,il marche n'est-ce pas?"(No problem, it works doesn't it?)

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 11
C
Chester Offline OP
Member
Hey guys,

Well, I am nearly finished with putting in the new Romex cable, the proper one for the job here - 10-3 with ground. Well, when I opened up the panel, I found a real mess there. I guess a guy who worked for the city utility department, or something like that, lived in the house previously. I assume he is the one who did the "rewiring." There I found grounding wires going into the neutral buses, and neutrals going into the grounding bus. They were mismatched all over the place! Plus, for the range and the heater unit, I found the same scheme as the previous one. He was using 10-2 on both, with the neutral acting as the other hot. I believe it is against the code to use white neutrals as hots, unless they have been properly remarked with black...anyway, it's a real mess, and I don't know if I wanna do all of these circuits myself. I worked very hard tonight....let me know what you think of all of this. BTW, if the neutral and the grounding bus in the panel are bonded together in the panel itself, (I believe they are) why can't neutrals go into the grounding bus, and vice versa?

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 524
Member
... If the panel you're referring to is a "Service Disconnect" with a "Main Breaker",then all the grounds and neutrals will land on the same bar..if it's a "Sub-Panel" that is derived from another panel,the grounds and neutrals MUST be kept separate..so that any errant current flowing on the neutral does not contact equipment grounds,..(chassis,etc.) and pose a very hazardous condition..this is my understanding...The rest of the gang here can probably illustrate this clearer for you.. Guys,..any takers??
Russ


.."if it ain't fixed,don't break it...call a Licensed Electrician"
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
P
Member
If you didn;t keep neutrals and equipment grounds separate in sub-panels, then you could end up with parallel paths for the neutral current via grounding conductors, including exposed conduit, raceways, etc.

Chester,
I don't want to confuse you too much by introducing irrelevant "foreign 'lectricity," but this is one topic where different parts of the world see things a different way.

Over here on the east side of the Big Pond, for example, we keep neutrals and grounds separate even in the main panel. The bond, if used at all, is made before the meter.

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 11
C
Chester Offline OP
Member
OK....guys, I am referring to the main panel in the garage, which does have a main disconnect at the top of the panel. This large breaker turns off the whole house, plus this panel receives the service cables. I don't even think this small house has a sub-panel. Anyway, given this situation, I take it, it is okay if neutral wires are attached to the grounding bus, and grounding wires to the neutral buses? (Three buses total on this main panel.) This is how the electrician wired it when the house went up, so I assume it is fine. Please let me know. (My textbook does not detail all this bus stuff very much.)

Thanks,
Chester

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 91
R
Member
yes, that is corrrect you can put either one on the grn bar or the neutral bar provided the neutral bar has been "bonded" to the box. this is usually accomplished by a dissimilar looking screw which runs through the bar itself and into the back of the panel. as you said "busses" (bars) i am assuming that there are two neutral bars which are factory bonded together. at times this is not readily apparent as the sometimes run the jumper bar behind plastic and you can only see the connection between the two bars. hope this helps, this can only be done like this at the main service.

[This message has been edited by rizer (edited 04-28-2004).]

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 197
T
Member
If the ground bar is an "add-on" that is screwed separately to the panel case, then you cannot have neutrals attached to it.

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