ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area Q on how best to pre-twist solid conductors

if you've ever taken a wire nut apart and had it spring open when its still got voltage then you know you should pre-twist the wires. twist the wires together and cut the end squaRE, IF YOUR ADDING STRANDED WIRE TO IT DONT TWIST IN THE STRANDED BUT LET THE END OF THE STRANDS SLIGHTLY LEAD THE ENDS OF THE SOLID WIRE. HOPE THIS HELPS.

I must be an idiot for jumping in on this but here I go.

None of the wirenut manufacturers say:

No twisting necessary

What they do say is:

No pretwisting necessary



Notice instruction 5, "Screw on until two twists are visible."

If you have two twists visible outside the wirenut the wires inside are twisted, try it before you say no.

Personally I think it is easer to pretwist than it is to twist on the wire nut that far, but it can be done and make a good splice.

Pretwist or Posttwist either way no one should be leaving the wires untwisted.

As far as wires popping out when you remove a wirenut you should not be working on hot circuits in the first place.

Take a look at instruction one

"1. Turn off power before installing or removing connectors"

Do not blame someone else for your choice to work unsafely.

Bob





[This message has been edited by iwire (edited 04-24-2004).]

"As far as wires popping out when you remove a wirenut you should not be working on hot circuits in the first place.
Take a look at instruction one
"1. Turn off power before installing or removing connectors"
Do not blame someone else for your choice to work unsafely"

Next time read my post, where did I say anything about removing a wirenut? I am talking about wires coming apart when you move a conductor thats in a j box or a can. This is typically the result of using a wire nut with out pretwisting.
As far as working on live power, it is part of the trade.

[This message has been edited by Joey D (edited 04-24-2004).]

Joey D, or anyone, if you want to quote a post, it can be done easy follow this link.
https://www.electrical-contractor.net/ubb/ubbcode.html

As for as working on live power, no employer can make you do that, if you decide on your own to go ahead and do so, you and you alone are responsible for what goes wrong no matter what the reason.

You will also be bringing your company or employer a world of trouble too.

Bob

When it comes to making connections, workmanship is the most important item. No method or material can overcome poor workmanship.

I've seen failures in twisted connections & untwisted connections & they seem to come from poor workmanship, not a failure of the wirenut.

IMO, there is no practical difference in the performance of the splice, regardless of the method, when the connection is properly made.

If the twisting of conductors made for a much safer splice, I think that by now, the NEC would have adopted it as a requirement.

Tom

are you telling me you never work anything hot? i find it hard to believe. some larger jobs the ones with 70 years of wiring dont lend themselves to shutting off a circuit when each floor has some 20 odd panels and no way of finding a circuit with out say shutting down an irs computer or power to other equipment. the buildings im refering to are huge not just the occational tenant fit up your probably more familiar with bob.

Tom

I think that says it all.


Rizer I work in all kinds of buildings is a 45 acre building big?

Many times I work in Data centers, try telling them you have to shut off circuits.

I did not say I have never worked hot, what I was getting at is no one should be blaming a bad splice for damage that occurs because they have decided to use a short cut and work hot.

Get a decent circuit tracer and you can find the circuit and shut it off.

Bob

Oh, the old pretwist or not story should i bring the wagos into game again ;D

iwire, Do you shut down a can or j box before opening the cover to do anything in there? I don't lay blame unless it needs to be. If you were to open a cover only to have a wire nut fall out, you would say, I don't blame the hack in there before me saving 10 seconds a splice to make more money, thats completely my fault? I doubt it unless you were the person that did it.

Not to beat this thing into the ground but 9 times out of 10 not pretwisting a splice will cause issue's due to improper method caused by the installer. I like to pretwist and some don't I work on live power, some don't. I guess I like to hold myself accountable for what the next guy sees in any of my work.

Well than we are the same, I like to hold myself responsible for what happens.

I refuse to lay blame on the person before me if everything was working until I started working on it.

Joey I do not want to beat this to death either but we should not be giving people new to the trade that working live is required or the right thing to do.


The company I work for strives to follow the OSHA regulations and reminds us regally that we are subject to termination if we are working live.

Does that get broken sometimes? Yes I will not lie to you.

You are aware there are very few reasons that OSHA regulations will let you be exposed to live parts?

Open a live panel without PPE and you are in violation, yes I do this and I can get fired for it.

Bob