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#222443 01/09/24 08:18 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,476
Likes: 3
Cat Servant
Member
Just got an e-mail cautioning me against buying "counterfeit code books." That's an interesting concern!

I, for one, am a firm believer in knowing your code. That means (for example), if you're in Chicago, you have the City of Chicago Code. Since "the law" is public domain, I have no problem with going to the City web site, downloading, and printing off the code for free. Or, alternatively, going to the bookstore and buying a nicely bound copy of the City code.

BTW, that's exactly what you do when you want a copy of your power company's standards.

What is the NEC and who are the NFPA? The NEC is but a "model" code, written by a private publishing house. The NEC isn't "the Code-" it's simply a template, a long list of suggestions. No one elected the NFPA into authority, the NEC is written completely apart from the legislative process, and can be best thought of as one novel that you'll never see made into a movie.

I've seen all manner of items sold on street corners, or unloaded from Chinese ships. (Remember the "Bolivia" watches?) Yet I've never seen a "counterfeit" NEC. Heck, now I might be inspired to write one -- call it the "Eclectic" code. Mandate receptacles that look like smiley faces. Require panels to have drink holders. Require square wires, because that's how we measure cross section.

1 member likes this: sabrown
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Joined: Jul 2004
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G
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I think we all understand the NFPA is a government mandated monopoly that makes it's money by printing books every 3 years. There was a court decision that made them put the NEC on their web site for free but that doesn't mean it is easy to use there or that you can copy it. I agree that as soon as something is adopted as public law it should be freely available but that is not the case with any NFPA standard and the NRTLs are even worse than that.
It is a huge money grab by people who print these books. It is also why we have so much code "churn" in the name of safety. NFPA should have their codes on a 10 year cycle but they wouldn't make nearly as much money.
It is really stupid that they close the ROP before most AHJs have even adopted the last version. Because of legislative inertia and the timing of Florida codes vs NFPA, Florida is always at least one cycle behind, most of the time 2. We are writing new code before anyone has any experience with the current one. It is also worrisome about how many manufacturers sit on the CMPs, pimping their latest research project to be in the code. There is no better example than Cuttler Hammer and the AFCI. They had that rammed into the 1999 code (to be implemented 3 years later) before they even had a working model. I got that straight from Harvey Johnson who was on the development team. Square D was forced to rush a device into the field that didn't work and had to be recalled, I bet half were never replaced. That device was literally beta tested in the customer's home at the point of a government gun.


Greg Fretwell
1 member likes this: sabrown
Joined: Apr 2002
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NJ is on the 2020 NEC, and the ECs and Inspectors are doing continuing ed on the 2023 for the hours needed for license renewals.

We are usually one cycle behind, and 'learning one cycle forward.

How the heck can a counterfeit NEC be discovered??


John
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,002
Likes: 35
G
Member
Florida is on the 20 now too, unamended (no local rules).
As for the "counterfeits", That is really copyright infringement. I know NFPA had a real hard time keeping bootleg copies of the soft copy off the internet. There are probably some out there now.
For the user, I suppose it all depends on how well it is printed although there were some cycles straight from NFPA that started falling apart right away.


Greg Fretwell
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,476
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Cat Servant
Member
Clarification time: The “caution” came in an email frame m THIS web site, almost certainly in jest, urging me to buy my codes here.

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,145
Likes: 4
Member
NFPA doesn't give big discounts to volume resellers like they did in years past. Big and small, the Discount is the same, and it's not very much. When you see an NEC selling at half the price you see at the NFPA website it's got to be a counterfeit copy.

I've seen some with poor, slightly blurry printing like they were done on a copy machine, slanted pages and bindings that don't hold up.

See: https://www.nfpa.org/ar/news-blogs-...er-beware-spotting-counterfeit-standards

I'm sure this is a situation that can only drive their prices higher.


Bill
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,476
Likes: 3
Cat Servant
Member
Amazing! I’ve never before heard of this.

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G
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At the price of the real book and the cost of production once they are scanned, I am shocked it isn't a bigger thing.
Even if you printed it on a homeowner laser printer at a dime a page it is $90, cheaper than the real thing but they are probably using an offset press banging them out at a penny a page. Put the 3 hole punch die in that press and you have a loose leaf NEC for less than $10. In Asia, that might even be half of that. If the printing is blurry or the image cock eyed, it just means the guy making the plate or mounting it was sloppy.
I worked on an offset press IBM marketed in the 60s that made this exact book at 25,000 pages an hour. (two sides, one color, 3 or 22 hole punch). It was fed from a roll of paper 3 feet in diameter and cut sheets at 8.5" (letter or "legal"). It was designed to produce our technical tips and we bought the rights to market it.


Greg Fretwell
1 member likes this: tortuga
Joined: Oct 2000
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I can see it being a big reason behind their price increases in recent years.

I don't know how many other standards are being copied but I did buy a hardcover version of something a couple years back that had sort of a milky white, dull look to the cover and I sent it back and left a bad review.


Bill
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 2
C
New Member
I am an Instructor for continuing education . I have seen a number of counterfeit books at my classes. Like everything else the quality varies . I have seen some you can’t tell the difference and others that are blurry and poor quality . The BIGGEST problem is missing pages, one guy bought one with 57 pages missing. Imagine 57 pages missing in Chapter 2 or 3 . You get what you pay for.
Best to buy directly from NFP, to avoid counterfeit.


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