ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals
ECN Shout Chat
ShoutChat Box
Recent Posts
2 circuit track lighting all of a sudden cross con
by gfretwell - 11/18/19 11:55 PM
Look at this mess...
by NORCAL - 11/15/19 10:21 PM
Fire source!
by sabrown - 11/07/19 08:39 AM
Parallel Conductor Divisor
by LongRunner - 11/04/19 02:21 AM
FPE in Germany
by Texas_Ranger - 10/29/19 05:12 AM
New in the Gallery:
FPE Breaker panel in germany
What is this for?
Who's Online Now
1 registered members (HotLine1), 4 guests, and 15 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
GEC water & rod (1 or 2?) #220119 07/01/19 01:13 PM
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 308
S
Steve T Offline OP
Member
2017 NEC. 250.53(D)(2) requires a water pipe to be supplemented, and if by a rod, pipe, or plate, they must conform with 250.53(A). 250.53(A)(2) requires a single rod to be supplemented (except if it has a resistance to earth of 25 ohms or less).

Question: Is a grounding electrode system that consists of a water pipe and ground rod considered a 'single rod'? To put it another way, is 250.53(A)(2) applicable when the grounding electrode system consists of a water pipe and a ground rod?

Its been a while, glad to see many of the same folks still here!! Thanks all.

2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
Re: GEC water & rod (1 or 2?) [Re: Steve T] #220120 07/02/19 09:11 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,412
G
gfretwell Offline
Member
The way I have always understood it a rod single rod that can't be demonstrated to have <25 ohm of ground contact is not an electrode but that may just be because we live in a sand box and we don't really trust rods that much anyway. I always see rods driven in pairs. That may also be that a rod is $15, 3-point (Fall-of-potential) test from an engineering company is a couple hundred bucks and arguing with an inspector is priceless wink


Greg Fretwell
Re: GEC water & rod (1 or 2?) [Re: Steve T] #220121 07/03/19 11:55 AM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,122
HotLine1 Online Content
Member
Yes, as Greg so eloquently stated the FOP test up here is around $500.00, and the one that I know of failed the testing brutally. Arguing with me, or any other inspector is really not a good thing. Healthy discussion is fine and appreciated.

IMHO, two (2) rods are what the code states. Up here the the water mains are plastic for at least 80% or more. UFER s are installed when it's new work. Others are 2 rods, and another code compliant choice, plate, etc.

It looks like metalic water piping is going to join the other relics, like knob & tube!


John
Re: GEC water & rod (1 or 2?) [Re: Steve T] #220122 07/03/19 04:13 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,412
G
gfretwell Offline
Member
I think as ground ring is probably the most effective electrode if sparky gets there after the footers are poured but the price of the copper makes it cost prohibitive. The state put it in the bid for the toll booths and radio towers in addition to Ufers and rods. They wanted good grounds. The Ufer connection being made available is part of the 1&2 family structural inspection here so it ends up being pretty universal.


Greg Fretwell
Re: GEC water & rod (1 or 2?) [Re: Steve T] #220240 09/04/19 09:01 AM
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 308
S
Steve T Offline OP
Member
Thanks all. Per response from NFPA, a rod, pipe, or plate electrode that supplements a water pipe is considered a 'single' electrode and has to be 25 ohms or less to earth, or be supplemented. I guess I was just getting hung up by the term 'system' as used in 250.50; and offering the possibility that a 'system' of multiple electrodes might not be interpreted as a 'single' electrode.


Featured:

2020 National Electrical Code
2020 National Electrical
Code (NEC)

* * * * * * *

2017 Master Electrician Exam Preparation Combos
2017 NEC Electrician
Exam Prep Combos:
Master / Journeyman

 

Member Spotlight
Tom
Tom
Shinnston, WV USA
Posts: 1,044
Joined: January 2001
Show All Member Profiles 
Top Posters(30 Days)
BigB 5
NORCAL 1
Popular Topics(Views)
260,712 Are you busy
195,744 Re: Forum
185,132 Need opinion
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3