ECN Forum Forums General Topics of the Trade General Discussion Area what is your answer to this question by law.

The answerto his question depends on the jurisdiction he is in.
Most of the place I have worked in do not require maintence persons reguardless of trade to be licensed. They are not supposed to do anything that changes the load of the service,- not installing new equipment no new runs of conduit and wire etc.
Of course they do this all the time, because the company management does not want to spend the money to have a compentent licensed electrician in the plant with inspectors to follow.
They may have a good maintence electrician but most have joe fly by nite working for maybe 1/2 what a journyman makes in thier area. I have seen SO cords run across shelves light fixtures and other equipment to power a new item temporaly for 5years or so.
What is needed is the AHJ's having the authority and actually going into these plants regularly. When the bean counters and management see no cost benifit to short cut, thier attitude will change.

[This message has been edited by nesparky (edited 11-20-2002).]

Our local AHJ requires all new equipment installed to be inspected regardless of who does the wiring. And beleive it or not we are in the state of PA! And I must say we have no fear of them because in our facility we pride ourselves in having everything up to code and will hold up our work against any contractor's work. In addition to the electrical inspector, We get Dept of Labor & Industry, OSHA and DEP in here ocasionally and have never had a bad experiance with any of them.
I'm not saying any of this to boast but only to say that there actually are places that run by the code. These are the places that electrical contractors never see because they have no reason to be in such places.

and therefor miss those quailty ME's Joe. i admit to my bias here, if only from experience (like gramps post..)

lemme sum it up this way, laws aside....

Not all that is licensed is qualified, and not all that is qualified is licensed.

peace

Here here!

Some of my favorite experiences was working for SS Electric in Sheboygan, WI at the two JL French Plants (Aluminum Die Casting). SSE handled all installation and construction, and the maintenance electricians kept 'em running. With white hats, clipboards and ties everywhere, everything was always squeaky clean. I hope it's OK to plug the good guys, and I'm here to say that it was a pleasure to work for them and along with my maintenance comrades.


[This message has been edited by sparky66wv (edited 11-18-2002).]

Here in Minnesota, the companies have two choices.

First and most common choice is to hire at least one "licensed master" electrician. If this route is taken, the rest of the crew need not hold any type of license, period. When the master is not actually on the job to supervise, the unlicensed personell can only maintain (no installs).

The second choice is where no master license is employed. If this is the case, every electrician must hold a maintenance licence. Again, they can maintain, but no installs. The industries involved had a lot of clout when the state set up these laws. Because they didn't want to have to pay the higher scales demanded by a journeyman, in this situation a maintenance licence carries more weight than a journeyman's license does. A journeyman cannot "maintain" without a master license overseeing him. (yeah I know, its rediculous).

The situation at the plant that I work at is very odd. We have 9 electricians, and one electrical supervisor. The supervisor holds a journeyman's licence (almost useless in this application by law). But three of the electricians (including myself) hold a masters license. All three have extensive backgrounds in construction (including union apprenticeships). One of them (not me), gets paid extra for being the "signing master". The rest of the electricians are unlicensed, and have a background in electronics. When hiring new electricians, we strive to keep an equal mix.

Matt



[This message has been edited by Matt M (edited 11-21-2002).]

Here is the answer in Ontario, Canada.

Under the OH&S act and enforced by the Ministry of Labour, not the Inspection Department.

OH&S Act & Regulations-1999-page #60.
(Excerpts)

Adoption of Training Requirements

1) The requirements for certification of trades prescribed in the regulations made under the Trades Qualification Act and set out in the schedule are adopted and prescribed in the standard with which every worker in those trades must comply.

3) Every employer who employs a worker in a trade set out in the schedule, other than a apprentice as defined in section 1 of the Trades and Qualifications Act, shall ensure that the worker holds a subsisting certificate of qualification in that trade or equivalent certificate of qualification issued by the province of Quebec.

Schedule:

Electrician, branch 1: construction & maintenance electrician

Electrician, branch 2; domestic and rural electrician

Tony Moscioni
Electrical Inspector
Electrical Safety Authority