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Wire in Air Return Duct #122013
09/13/05 11:05 PM
09/13/05 11:05 PM
Admin  Offline
OP
Administrator
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,517
NY, USA
Quote
Wire in Air Return Duct -
Or- is it the other way around? In this older building, currently being restored, the HVAC guy "made a duct" by sealing a joist bay with a sheet of metal.

In this pic, you are looking into the opening where the return air grille sets. Please note the K & T wire mounted inside this duct.

- renosteinke
[Linked Image]

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Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122014
09/14/05 07:05 AM
09/14/05 07:05 AM
I
IanR  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 328
Palm Bay FL USA
Efficient utilization of space?

Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122015
09/14/05 12:18 PM
09/14/05 12:18 PM
Alan Belson  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,803
Mayenne N. France
Nice figured timber. Oak?

Alan


Wood work but can't!
Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122016
09/14/05 12:44 PM
09/14/05 12:44 PM
T
Texas_Ranger  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,430
Vienna, Austria
Would guesss so, especially the first pic really looks like oak. Badly butchered around the hole though!

Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122017
09/14/05 06:21 PM
09/14/05 06:21 PM
A
alan bergold  Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 42
east meadow ny
I THING THIS WAS A STANDARD PRACTICE FOR HVAC BACK IN THE DAY. BUT CHOOSING A BAY WHERE KNOB+TOBE WIRING IS LOCATED IS JUST PLAIN STUPID....


JBIELECTRIC EAST MEADOW NY
Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122018
09/14/05 08:04 PM
09/14/05 08:04 PM
S
ShockMe77  Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 821
Rahway, New Jersey
Now why on earth would someone NOT USE an electrician here is beyond me. I hate when those outlets are on the molding like that cus' I know some BS wiring like this can't be too far away. I would guess the wiring was there before the duct was. Really no excuse for this kind of work.

Brutal, just brutal.

[This message has been edited by ShockMe77 (edited 09-14-2005).]

Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122019
09/14/05 08:43 PM
09/14/05 08:43 PM
renosteinke  Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,316
Blue Collar Country
Let's get out our codebooks and see what the NEC has to say....anyone?

Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122020
09/14/05 08:45 PM
09/14/05 08:45 PM
E
e57  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
S.F.,CA USA
Wiring K&T inside a plenum isn't in the Not permited section? (394.12) Its not hip in my mind, but may be allowed?

I figure the wiring came first, but who knows, it was 40-80 years ago.

As for base board mounted recepticals, I do it all the time (matching existing and new.), many prefer it.


Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122021
09/15/05 06:24 PM
09/15/05 06:24 PM
Lostazhell  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,431
Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Speaking of the baseboard recept, My father in law has a house that was built sometime in the late 1800's (I found an "afterthought" fusible switch that was tied into somekind of K&T "loop" in the attic that was dated 1905) and the walls aren't thick (deep) enough to fit a standard depth cut in box inside, unless you place it in the baseboard were it adds some extra depth....

-Randy

Re: Wire in Air Return Duct #122022
09/15/05 08:15 PM
09/15/05 08:15 PM
renosteinke  Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,316
Blue Collar Country
300.22 discusses wiring methods permitted in ducts. K & T isn't one of the permitted methods.
That aside, this duct was certainly made after the wire was in place, and well after the building was first put up. The resulting violation is probably due to ignorance on the part of the installer.

The short version: wiring inside ducts has to be in a metal conduit of some sort, or be miner-insulated cable.

I have often seen wires pass through ducts- form side to side- but this is the first time I've seen the wires running lengthwise within the duct.

I am told, by my friends in the HVAC community, that such "made" ducts have prooven to be rather poor ducts, and that the practice of making a duct by closing off a joist bay is abvoided by better contractors. It may (I don't really know) also violate some of the newer energy codes.

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