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#107554 09/07/04 06:48 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,876
e57 Offline
A Knox Box is either a Key box, or keyed switch, so the Fire Department doesn't drive the truck through the door/gate/wall to gain entry. And, the FD had better see it, so make it really visable to them, or they give it like 10 seconds before starting up saws and the like. I used to be an EMT, and noticed that most FD guys would rather cut through a door, than unlock it. (Just for kicks.)

So, anyway iwire, speaking of medical attention, has anyone gotten hurt there, yet? Or, the wise just stay clear?

Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
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#107555 09/07/04 08:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,391
iwire Offline OP
Big Guy

If you look around this site you will find pictures of my work.

Yes I have run jobs that I would not want to show pictures of here, not every job is pretty.

After looking again at the pic,s I don't see no live wire's on the floor.

Picture 1 the bundle of yellow stuff coming out of the panel, running across the floor is wire and it is live.

NM cable even when used for temps is not hard usage cord.

The romax is ok for temp

Yes, I use it for temps all the time.

and does not need to be staped as often in the ceiling

Can you show me a code that says that?

The NM in the trusses is not temp it is permanent, it is required to be supported every 4.5'.

Why don't you tell this guy that there is pic's on the net of his job?

I have no idea who he or she is.

It is not fair that the job is not done and you are cutting this guy up with know Idea of what is going on.

I am willing to go out on a limb and assume that this job is not going to suddenly clean up. I do have a pretty good idea of what is going on and the diffacult job they have here. They are trying to do a major remodel without disrupting the store.

I have run jobs like that and it is very hard, so what, you still have to follow the rules.

How can you or anybody say anything with out being there on the job working on this project with the guy doing it

There is absolutely no excuse for using cardboard to cover 480 busbars. This is dangerous, irresponsible and would be a major issue if OSHA shows up.

Maybe he can take some pic's of your jobs before it is all done.

People take pictures of my jobs often, GCs engineers, owners representatives. And while they may not always be perfect you will never see my jobs looking like this one.

Keep running everybody else down your doing a good job

I am sorry you feel that way, I must assume you have not read many of my posts.


Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
#107556 09/07/04 10:24 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 745
Bob: I guess the thing that scares me the most is those 480v. sections, left for all intents and purposes, completely unprotected (and appearing to be pretty permanent). Several questions:
1. What kind of main lug amperage could be encountered in these panels,
2. Is there a main disconnect of some sort located in this electric room (or somewhere nearby), and
3. Referring to the first picture, what is going on in the very large panel across the aisle from the SqD add-on panel? It looks like it's "taped up" also.

Mike (mamills)

#107557 09/08/04 03:17 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 59
All I was saying is that with not being there and knowing what is going on The only thing I see wrong is the cardboard on the switchgear.

1926.405(a)(ii)(B) say's that you can fasten temp wire at not more then 10 ft intervals

info came from the OSHA standards for the construction industry

#107558 09/08/04 03:57 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 840
Big guy,


Huh? What are you talking about?

NM cable cannot be run where subject to physical damage. Are you going to tell us that running romex on the floor is not subject to physical damage? Temporary or not, it is wrong.

The only thing I see wrong is the cardboard on the switchgear.

So you don't consider a long bundle of cables to be a problem? [Linked Image]


#107559 09/08/04 04:54 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 59
If you have a bundle more than 24 " you have to derate
and yes I know you can't run NM cable on the floor
but we are talking temp wire here
The NEC has Art 527 but you have to go buy OSHA also for temp power.
The temp panel was wire coming out of it on the floor.
these wire's are called a branch circuit.
OSHA say's that branch circuit's can not be laying on the floor.
If you don't have a OSHA book you need to get one.

#107560 09/08/04 07:48 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 697
I recently saw an installation for a small machine using an 18 ga. cord on a 20-amp three-phase breaker. The electrician put some blue painters tape next to the breaker to label it "temporary".

Please note 527.2(A)Other Articles.
Except as specifically modified in this article, all other requirements of this Code for permanent wiring shall apply to temporary wiring installations.


#107561 09/10/04 09:57 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 57
What the !!!!!! Geeze,! This is a catastrophe just waiting to happen. Who originally wired this place? I'm lost for words...

"Live the dream, you only get one chance."
#107562 09/10/04 10:05 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 57
I forgot to mention after looking again at the pics.yes, you are right, it DOES look like those breakers are tripped. Hmmmm, imagine that. "I cant figure out why my breakers keep tripping!"

"Live the dream, you only get one chance."
#107563 09/11/04 02:24 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 220
" no branch circuit conductors shall not be laid on the floor" . this is a double negative. are you saying that all Branch circuits are to be laid on the floor? [Linked Image]

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