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#98801 - 06/07/06 06:16 PM Pancake box
George Little Offline
Member

Registered: 01/18/04
Posts: 1492
Loc: Michigan USA
Are the inspectors allowing 3" pancake boxes for mounting light fixtures? Remember the cu. in. fill for this size box is 4 cu. in.
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#98802 - 06/08/06 06:57 AM Re: Pancake box
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
Sure- and why not?

Indeed, they are often used for ceiling fans as well.

The only problem is wire fill... if the circuit continues on to another fixture, then wire fill is violated. There's only enough room (legally) for one set of wires.

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#98803 - 06/08/06 08:50 AM Re: Pancake box
Alan Nadon Offline
Member

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 398
Loc: Elkhart, IN. USA
Short answer NO
4 cu inches ( 65 cm cubed) allows for the end of a 14 / 2, no ground, nothing else.
Fixture canopys add space but, unless they are marked with the Cu. In. they should not be counted.
Almost anyplace that a pan box can be used an L shaped box, i.e. pan with a wiring compartment on one side, would do better.
I once asked an engineer at Raco why they kept making the 3" pans and he said, Because inspectors kept allowing them to pass inspection.
Alan--
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#98804 - 06/08/06 07:38 PM Re: Pancake box
BigB Offline
Member

Registered: 03/31/04
Posts: 727
Loc: Tucson, AZ USA
reno you must be thinking he said 4" pancake like I did at first.

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#98805 - 06/08/06 10:54 PM Re: Pancake box
Tesla Offline
Member

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 1280
Loc: Sacramento, CA
Use listed #18 lighting whips in 3/8" Flex.

Problem gone....

You will need to have a junction box within 6 feet for the listed whip.

Alternately, for lighting only you can use the tap rules to run your own #18 even longer.

Look at NEC 2005 table 240.5

[This message has been edited by Tesla (edited 06-09-2006).]

[This message has been edited by Tesla (edited 06-18-2006).]
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#98806 - 06/09/06 04:56 PM Re: Pancake box
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
Big B, I bet you're right. I'm not sure I've ever seen the smaller one!

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#98807 - 06/12/06 06:06 PM Re: Pancake box
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1355
Loc: West Jordan, Utah, USA
I let people use them if there is only one 14-2 in the box.
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Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

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#98808 - 06/12/06 11:19 PM Re: Pancake box
gfretwell Offline

Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9045
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
Doesn't the fixture canopy add to the capacity?

 Quote:
410.10 Space for Conductors.
Canopies and outlet boxes taken together shall provide adequate space so that luminaire (fixture) conductors and their connecting devices can be properly installed.


If the luminaire had a flat base that effectively stopped the box fill at the face of the box I could see the concern but if this is a bell canopy there should be plenty of room, even for two sets of #12s.
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#98809 - 06/13/06 04:01 AM Re: Pancake box
George Little Offline
Member

Registered: 01/18/04
Posts: 1492
Loc: Michigan USA
410.10 makes no mention of using the canopy of a fixture as space for branch circuit conductors, only the fixture conductors and their connecting devices. The branch circuit conductors are poperly housed in the box. If it were a 4" pan box it would properly house a single 14/2 WG NM cable and the fixture wires could be housed in the canopy. A 3" pan box is quite clearly not suitable for 14/2 WG NM cable but most of us, like Ryan would accept it.

Typo's

[This message has been edited by George Little (edited 06-13-2006).]
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