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#95694 - 09/27/05 11:06 PM New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
e57 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
Old...
 Quote:
250.104(b) Metal Gas Piping. Each aboveground portion of a gas piping system upstream from the equipment shutoff valve shall be electrically continuous and bonded to the grounding electrode system.


New...
 Quote:
250.104(B) Other Metal Piping. Where installed in or attached to a building or structure, metal piping system(s), including gas piping, that may become energized shall be bonded to the service equipment enclosure, the grounded conductor at the service, the grounding electrode conductor where of sufficient size, or to the one or more grounding electrodes used. The bonding jumper(s) shall be sized in accordance with 250.122 using the rating of the circuit that may energize the piping system(s). The equipment grounding conductor for the circuit that may energize the piping shall be permitted to serve as the bonding means. The points of attachment of the bonding jumper(s) shall be accessible.
FPN:Bonding all piping and metal air ducts within the premises will provide additional safety.
Section 250.104(B) was revised for the 2002 Code to state that gas piping is treated exactly the same as all "other metal piping" systems within a building.


Anyone have a copy of the 2004/5 CEC to know if this got changed to the 2002 wording? Are we still bonding gas to the GEC?
_________________________
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

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#95695 - 09/28/05 08:03 AM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
sandsnow Offline
Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 163
Loc: Irvine, CA, USA
There are no CA ammendments to this section in the 2004 CEC.

To everyone, feel free to ask about any other CA ammendments. I don't have a list of them, but I will look up the section for you.
_________________________
Larry LeVoir
Inspector
City of Irvine, CA

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#95696 - 09/28/05 06:49 PM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
CTwireman Offline
Member

Registered: 02/07/02
Posts: 839
Loc: Connecticut, USA
Ok, I got one for you Golden State guys. Do you have a code requirement to have a grounding lug in non-metallic boxes for luminaires?

When I visited my friends home while it was being built, they used 3" round plastic nail on boxes that had a small grounding lug in them. All of the homes in the area had them. It sure looked weird to my "back east" viewpoint. They used them everywhere: all the outside lights, the inside lights, the attic lights and the garage lights.

Oh, and I'd never seen cord and plug connected furnaces before. Yeah, we've allready had that debate.
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#95697 - 09/28/05 06:55 PM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
Scott35 Offline

Broom Pusher and
Member

Registered: 10/19/00
Posts: 2724
Loc: Anaheim, CA. USA
I just picked up my copy of the 2004 C.E.C. (Title 24, Part 3) today, and read through the California Matrix Adoption Tables to see who is doing what.

Also reading through Articles 80 and 89, just for "fun"

This will be the first time I have viewed and referenced anything based on the 2002 NEC (Model Code), as prior to August 1st, the 2001 C.E.C. used the 1999 NEC as Model Code.

Interesting thing (at least to me, though), is that DOSH ("OSHA") continues with the 1995 edition of the C.E.C. remaining effective - which would be 1993 NEC Model Code - and has not adopted the 1996, 1999 or 2002 edition of the NEC.

On (kind-of) the same subject, I just got two Commercial T.I. Design/Build Projects, which I will be performing Electrical Systems Design on - and these Buildings' Permits will be applied for after October 1st; so the newest version of the Energy Standards will be in effect.
(2005 version of Title 24, Part 6, chapter 5 & 6 - Lighting Efficiency Standards)

I have downloaded the PDF file format 2005 version non-residential compliance manuals, notes and such, yet I see no compliance forms in either PDF or AutoCAD DWG / DFX file format.

Anyone used the 2005 Bldg. Efficiency Standards yet?

Scott35
_________________________
Scott " 35 " Thompson
Just Say NO To Green Eggs And Ham!

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#95698 - 09/29/05 05:28 PM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
sandsnow Offline
Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 163
Loc: Irvine, CA, USA
The forms are part of the compliance manuals.

I haven't had the pleasure (agony) of enforcing, but I'm giving a class on Tuesday on just non-residential lighting.

BTW, I think there is one state agency that adopts Art. 80, don't have my book here. OSHPD I think????
_________________________
Larry LeVoir
Inspector
City of Irvine, CA

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#95699 - 09/30/05 04:44 PM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
scameron81 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 80
Loc: Healdsburg, ca, USA
I don't know if there is a code requirement for the "grounded plastic box". Those boxes you are talking about are the ultra cheap blue boxes that are found in the big orange store. My theory on them is that they are for light fixtures that don't have a ground tail on them thereby grounding the light through the fixture screw. I haven't ever used them. I am not sure what purpose they serve because almost every light I have ever seen has a ground tail already attached.

I had the same culture shock when I went to New York to visit. I felt like I was in another country with all the se cable and the meter bases on the sides of houses, and the meter/ disconects on the outside of commercial buildings instead of switchgear, it was real neat to see all the differences in the way things are done.

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#95700 - 09/30/05 11:20 PM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
Scott35 Offline

Broom Pusher and
Member

Registered: 10/19/00
Posts: 2724
Loc: Anaheim, CA. USA
Hello sandsnow, thanks for replying!

If you do not mind, I have a question to toss your way.

 Quote:

I haven't had the pleasure (agony) of enforcing, but I'm giving a class on Tuesday on just non-residential lighting.


Would your Plancheck Dept. accept the 2001 compliance forms (LTG), on a Planset submitted between October 5th and October 12th of this year?

I ask of this because there are two projects that I am designing, which will be going to Plancheck within those dates; and as mentioned in my previous post, I cannot find "Stand-Alone" 2005 version compliance forms.

I should elaborate a bit on this:
I am looking for "Stand-Alone" compliance forms, instead of having to extract the ones included with the compliance manual.

I already have the 2001 version compliance forms in AutoCAD file format, which have been used as "Base Templates" on many projects in the past few years.

The AutoCAD file format versions are about the only useful ones for me, but with "some" (read: A WHOLE LOT OF!!!) effort, the .PDFs can be filled out, then converted into something I can import / attach to my AutoCAD page template(s), and plot with the complete "E" sheets planset.

The same externally referenced form(s) can also be printed on individual 8½"×11" pages, and compiled to a 3-ring binder (for Bldg. Dept. file archives).

Getting them out of the manual is a bit more work, but not impossible.

One other thing, when will your Dept. begin enforcing the items covered in the 2005 Non-Residential Compliance Manual?

Anyhow, feel free to contact me directly via E-mail if needed.
My address (phonetically) is:

setelectric at pacbell dot net

TIA!!!

Scott35

BTW, where can I sign up for your Non-Residential Lighting class, or other classes?

edited to add the above quandry regarding classes!

[This message has been edited by Scott35 (edited 10-01-2005).]
_________________________
Scott " 35 " Thompson
Just Say NO To Green Eggs And Ham!

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#95701 - 10/01/05 08:41 AM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
sandsnow Offline
Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 163
Loc: Irvine, CA, USA
Scott
Quick answer would be no on the 2001 forms. You would need a variance from the BO to use 2001 forms. I haven't looked to see if the same compliance info can be entered, which would be the big issue.
BTW, there is no equivalent for the acceptance forms.
As far as the forms in the autocad format, who published those for 2001: the state?

The class is at Hometown buffet in Santa Ana 17th and Lincoln. It's the regular IAEI Orange Empire Meeting.
12 Noon. $10.00 includes food. No advance registration required. We're out by 2:00 - 2:30
EDucation program is One hour, so I cannot go into too much detail on any one topic, but will cover all the changes and we'll see where the questions take us. I'm trying most to give inspectors an idea of what they will see on the plans and what to look for in the field.
_________________________
Larry LeVoir
Inspector
City of Irvine, CA

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#95702 - 10/01/05 03:28 PM Re: New CA NEC (CEC) gas rules?
dana1028 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/09/02
Posts: 163
Loc: San Carlos, CA
Scott35

"BTW, where can I sign up for your Non-Residential Lighting class, or other classes?"

Scott - PG&E offers scores of energy related courses for free (actually the consumer pays for these courses in their monthly utility bill).

Check out: www.pge.com/education_training/


If you are looking in Southern Calif. then the utility company serving that area offers similar classes (So. Cal Edison?).

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