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#94051 - 07/04/05 06:44 PM SER cable in conduit
master66 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 260
Loc: Masontown, PA, USA
I am pretty sure that it is not allowed but I can't find where it says that type SE or SER cable cannot be installed in conduit for a complete run of say...60 feet.

I have to inspect a job that my electrician wannabe brother-in-law did where I know that he installed two 200a subfeeds in a small garage in PVC conduit using SER cable (4/0).

Anyone I know would have used THHN and it would not be an issue but he doesn't know any better.

Help me justify failing the installation or tell me if I'm wrong.

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#94052 - 07/04/05 07:06 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5305
Loc: Blue Collar Country
I have reviewed both the NEC and the UL "White Book." Neither specifically address the issue- it appears that no one considered it.
Type USE is severely limited in its' indoor applications, but there is no such limit on SE.

Since it is not specifically prohibited, I would say it is allowed- especially if there is a desire for additional mechanical protection.
However, I would consider the issue of de-rating, as is done with Romex. While there is no official temperature rating for the assembly (unlike Romex, which is 60 degrees), it seem reasonable to treat SE in a like manner.

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#94053 - 07/04/05 08:06 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
gfretwell Offline

Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9045
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
The most immediate issue would be wire fill. It is considered one conductor with the diameter of the maximum dimension so a pipe fills up fast.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

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#94054 - 07/04/05 08:23 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
George Little Offline
Member

Registered: 01/18/04
Posts: 1492
Loc: Michigan USA
I looked in the '02 NEC at Article 352 Sect 352.22 and it seens to say no- SER installed in RNMC would not be a code compliant installation because SER is not specifically identified for use in a raceway. Some cables are identified as being acceptable when installed in a raceway: Fire alarm cable (760.54) NM cable for short sections (334.15 (B)) Class 2 & 3 cables (725.55(C)). I do not see that kind of wording for SER or SE cables.

Now if you go to the '05 code Article 352 Section 352.22 is worded diffeently and it might change things. Now why anyone would want to install a raceway system and then pull in SER or SE cable is beyond me. The chance of overfilling the raceway or damaging the cable is very high.
_________________________
George Little

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#94055 - 07/04/05 08:33 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
George Little Offline
Member

Registered: 01/18/04
Posts: 1492
Loc: Michigan USA
I almost forgot- If this is an underground installation then the Listing for SE or SER cable would be violated since it is only listed for above ground.
_________________________
George Little

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#94056 - 07/05/05 05:11 AM Re: SER cable in conduit
Elmer Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/19/05
Posts: 3
Loc: N.Hempstead
I came across the same situation: SER in 21/2" pvc #80 outside od house. 50' run,2-90% and 1-LB then to meter main. Cable tech. drill a hole in the conduit and shorted out the feed. I told them that I needed to replace the conduit and install the correct cable (THHN). What you had was a violation. They said prove it. I opened up the code book and look & look, but could not find any thing to support my statement. It would seem that SER in such a run of pvc would be wrong. Maybe ampacity,number of conductors in conduit would play out in the code? Would that large of SER 200amp size bent in a LB a violation. That must have been someting to install. Or my last one was "not completing conduit run before installing cable". ????

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#94057 - 07/05/05 08:37 AM Re: SER cable in conduit
markp Offline
Member

Registered: 04/12/04
Posts: 60
Loc: Kent, WA, USA
George, what about 338.10(B)(4)? This says for interior runs of SE, you use the part I and II rules for NM cable. But the NM rules only seem to get you a physical protection run of conduit and not necessarily a complete conduit system.
_________________________
Mark
Kent, WA

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#94058 - 07/05/05 06:24 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
shortcircuit Offline
Member

Registered: 06/27/04
Posts: 608
Loc: massachusetts
312.5(C) requires cables to be secured to each cabinet,cutout box or meter socket enclosure...

314.17(B) requires the cable to be secured to boxes and conduit bodies...

These rules would seem to disallow the use of type SE cable in a raceway...

shortcircuit

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#94059 - 07/05/05 07:01 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
master66 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 260
Loc: Masontown, PA, USA
Went to inspect it today. two runs about 100' each. He said that he stripped the insulation off of the entire cable before installation.

He's driving me nuts. What would you do?

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#94060 - 07/05/05 08:48 PM Re: SER cable in conduit
gfretwell Offline

Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9045
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
He sure wouldn't like my answer.
When you strip the jacket off any cable assembly you end up with an unlisted/unlabelled conductor of unknown properties.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

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