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#87042 - 01/16/04 04:27 PM Kitchen counter tops
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1355
Loc: West Jordan, Utah, USA
Would you ask for GFCI protection for the area on the left (foreground)?

_________________________
Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

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#87043 - 01/16/04 04:59 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
NJwirenut Offline
Member

Registered: 09/15/01
Posts: 816
Loc: Bergen County, NJ
If I were homeowner--absolutely.

If I were AHJ--nope. It might be a good idea, but I don't think the NEC requires it here. Too far from the sink.

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#87044 - 01/16/04 05:31 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
electricman2 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/09/03
Posts: 234
Loc: Thomasville, NC USA
210.8(A)(6)specifies GFCI in kitchens where receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces. Is this a countertop surface? Since "countertop surface" is not defined, could you call it a work surface or something else? Is this a part of the kitchen? Food for thought here.
_________________________
John

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#87045 - 01/16/04 05:50 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1355
Loc: West Jordan, Utah, USA
Wirenut: Where in 21.8 is proximity to the sink addressed?

Electircman: Food for thought indeed. Thats why I posted it

I think we can get some good conversation here.

BTW: Where does the kitchen end? Is it the passageway on the left? Is it the transition from the hardwood floor to the carpet?

Let me add that the material is the same as the countertop near the sink.
_________________________
Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

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#87046 - 01/16/04 05:56 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
stamcon Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/01
Posts: 322
Loc: So San Francisco CA
Ryan, it looks like a "desktop" to me.

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#87047 - 01/16/04 05:59 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
Ryan_J Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1355
Loc: West Jordan, Utah, USA
Stamcon: I have no problem with your interpretation, but would the judge and jury have a problem with it if someone got killed? A human death is what got the requirement in commercial kitchens, as you know.
_________________________
Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

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#87048 - 01/16/04 06:26 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
electricman2 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/09/03
Posts: 234
Loc: Thomasville, NC USA
Quote by Ryan
 Quote:
I think we can get some good conversation here.

Like the firehouse kitchen thread, huh?
_________________________
John

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#87049 - 01/16/04 06:37 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
Bill Addiss Offline
Member

Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 4196
Loc: NY, USA
Ryan,

What do the Plans say that room is?


Bill

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#87050 - 01/16/04 06:41 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
Roger Offline
Member

Registered: 05/18/02
Posts: 1779
Loc: N.C.
Here's my take on this. If there is no code that would define a line (real or imaginary)
to separate this area from the kitchen, then by the open space alone, I'd consider it an extension of the kitchen by design.

Roger

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#87051 - 01/16/04 07:01 PM Re: Kitchen counter tops
stamcon Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/01
Posts: 322
Loc: So San Francisco CA
Ryan, when the '99NEC specifies GFCI's on receptacles serving residential kitchen
"countertops" and not all kitchen receptacles, where do we draw the line for safety? Why not all receptacles in the house be GFCI and AFCI? When the NEC considers the kitchen, pantry, breakfast room and dining room as different rooms(small appliance circuits), who makes the call as to what the room is? What's stated on the plans?

steve

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