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#85269 - 06/14/03 06:04 AM Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Joe Tedesco Offline
Member
Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3325
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts USA
Are the sides of "Gem" Boxes, OK for this required NEC Article 300 protection?



Photo Courtesy: www.joetedesco.com Gallery

[This message has been edited by Joe Tedesco (edited 06-14-2003).]
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#85270 - 06/14/03 07:35 AM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Electricmanscott Offline
Member
Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 1478
Loc: Holden, MA USA
Why not? I don't think they are even needed at all in this example.
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#85271 - 06/14/03 07:49 AM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Joe Tedesco Offline
Member
Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3325
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts USA
Electricmanscott:

Yes, I too agree that these are OK, and were required here because the distance was more that 1-1/4 " from the face of the stud to the first part of the drilled hole.

Does the Massachusetts Electrical Code amendments have a smaller distance here?

NOTE: Here's a Proposed Change for the 2005 NEC:

Quote:
Proposal 3-24, Section 300.4(A)(1).

The Panel accepted a new type of nail plate
less than the standard 1/16 in. thick plate from previous codes. This plate must be listed as an equivalent to the 1/16 in. plate plus be individually marked so the inspector can verify its listing even after installation.


Now I can see some new inspector calling for "listed plates" if this is put into the code, probably with no field experience!

Everyone knows what a "GEM BOX" is, right?


Thanks for you comment!!
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#85272 - 06/14/03 12:28 PM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
PCBelarge Offline
Member
Registered: 06/08/03
Posts: 657
Loc: Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
Hey Joe

Take a close look at the right nail plate. If my eyes are correct(?) it looks as though the nail supporting the nail plate is in line with the wire, hopefully it is too short to reach the wire.

Pierre
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#85273 - 06/14/03 08:45 PM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Elzappr Offline
Member
Registered: 12/20/01
Posts: 273
Loc: Oregon
Note: the nail plate will not always protect the wire. I once found a nail shot right through a nail plate (caused by nailing outside window trim in a modular home), piercing the romex and causing an arcing ground fault. The plates work fine for sheet rock screws, but are no match for nail guns. I keep this in mind when I decide where I am going to drill, so that I don't need to use nail plates for the outside surface of the studs...only the inside surfaces.
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#85274 - 06/15/03 06:50 AM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Joe Tedesco Offline
Member
Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3325
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts USA
The nail was not long enough to touch the cable, and if it did the place would have probably burned down after the circuit was energized.

Thanks for the hint about the nail penetration at the window trim, sure sounds like a real scary situation!

PS: How many sheet rockers remove the plates anyway after the inspection??
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#85275 - 06/15/03 11:15 AM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Gwz Offline
Member
Registered: 04/29/02
Posts: 199
Everyone probably has 'horror' stories.

A few years ago, saw where the siding guy's had driven a 16P nail for scaffoldling into the back of Service panelboard. Luckily the nail did not hit an ungrounded portion of the panelboard.

And like Alzappr noted, the drywall usually does not have the 'body' for the screw to thru the metal plate.

Then again when drywallers fasten the drywall to one side of the stud, the metal plates 'fall off of the studs' on the opposite side.
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#85276 - 06/16/03 01:35 PM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
sparky Offline
Member
Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
Quote:
Proposal 3-24, Section 300.4(A)(1).

The Panel accepted a new type of nail plate
less than the standard 1/16 in. thick plate from previous codes. This plate must be listed as an equivalent to the 1/16 in. plate plus be individually marked so the inspector can verify its listing even after installation.


Am i to take this as being that inspectors cannot visibly discern 1/16" ???
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#85277 - 06/16/03 06:07 PM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
Fred Offline
Member
Registered: 04/30/01
Posts: 461
Loc: Straughn, IN 47387
"Yes, I too agree that these are OK, and were required here because the distance was more that 1-1/4 " from the face of the stud to the first part of the drilled hole."

If the distance from the face of the stud to the first part of the drilled hole was MORE than 1-1/4" no plate is required.
I don't mean to nitpick, and I know what Joe meant, but I had an inspector as few years ago that interpreted this rule in reverse, as Joe stated it. He required the near side of a bored hole to be no more than 1-1/4" from the stud face. If it was deeper he required a nail plate. It took better than an hour to explain the reasoning behind a nail plate.
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#85278 - 06/17/03 04:12 AM Re: Nailplates or Kickplates Required for Protection
sparky Offline
Member
Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
I've used 4 sq blanks , plumbers larger plates, and various box sides in a pinch also.

To have them all 'be listed' to what is an obvious usage would mean that many field applications such as this would be null and void on a technicality, NOT that of a safety issue

perhaps the nail plate industry is PO'ed here and has infiltrated the CMP ???

Steve~ (aka grassy knollster) sparky
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