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#7811 - 02/22/02 01:42 PM GFI Protection
Frank Cinker Offline
Member

Registered: 07/29/01
Posts: 317
Loc: Pennsylvania
Would an under cabinet mounted microwave oven require GFI protection if a single receptacle were used. It's a dwelling unit application. The cabinet is above the kitchen counter.

[This message has been edited by Frank Cinker (edited 02-23-2002).]

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#7812 - 02/22/02 01:58 PM Re: GFI Protection
rbiro Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/01
Posts: 19
Loc: Pacifica, CA USA
I'll take a stab. 2002 210.8(A)(6) Says GFI protection is required in

Kitchens -- where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces.

So I think that would most likely mean no. However, I think it would be better to use a GFI if the outlet is readily accessible or the microwave is near a sink even if it is not required.

I don't think it matters if you use a single or duplex outlet in a kitchen, however the exceptions for basements and garages do make a distinction, so it would probably be better to use a single outlet.

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#7813 - 02/22/02 02:15 PM Re: GFI Protection
Redsy Offline
Member

Registered: 03/28/01
Posts: 2138
Loc: Bucks County PA
I had this situation a few weeks ago. The oven was mounted in a cabinet and the receptacle was installed behind it, out of reach of any countertop appliance cord. The unit was within arms reach of the sink, and then I thought that if the ground was compromised and a fault occurred a serious situation could be avoided for $10.00. I installed a GFCI.

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#7814 - 02/22/02 02:25 PM Re: GFI Protection
Electricmanscott Offline
Member

Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 1478
Loc: Holden, MA USA
Frank, If the receptacle is accesible I would probably say yes. Redsy, in your case I would say no. While I admire your thoughts on safety I would question a couple of things, tripped GFI may turn into "what did that electrician do my micro doesnt work" Also what about all the other appliances. DW, Disposal, Range, Cooktop, Oven etc....

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#7815 - 02/22/02 03:30 PM Re: GFI Protection
Frank Cinker Offline
Member

Registered: 07/29/01
Posts: 317
Loc: Pennsylvania
As Electricians we all know it's better to provide GFI protection when in doubt. The tricky part is trying to determine if it is required. As Electricmanscott mentioned, and what I call "potential nuisance tripping" isn't good either.

[This message has been edited by Frank Cinker (edited 02-23-2002).]

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#7816 - 02/22/02 03:52 PM Re: GFI Protection
Bill Addiss Offline
Member

Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 4196
Loc: NY, USA
Frank,

I do not think a GFCI is required if the receptacle is in a cabinet (above Microwave) it cannot serve the countertop loads.

I have another question;
What about the Receptacles in an Appliance Garage? Do they technically require GFCI protection?

Bill

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#7817 - 02/22/02 07:49 PM Re: GFI Protection
Electricmanscott Offline
Member

Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 1478
Loc: Holden, MA USA
I would say yes. As they are serving countertop areas.

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#7818 - 02/22/02 09:22 PM Re: GFI Protection
resqcapt19 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2209
Loc: IL
Bill,
Before the 2002 code came out I would have said that the receptacles in an appliance garage had to have GFCI protection, but the new code tells us that any receptacles in appliance garages can't be counted as the required countertop receptacles. If they can't be counted as a required counter receptacle, then they must not be intended to serve the countertop, and if the don't serve the countertop, GFCI protection is not required. I would expect that this will be changed in the '05 code to require GFCI protection for the appliance garage receptacles.
Don(resqcapt19)
_________________________
Don(resqcapt19)

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#7819 - 02/22/02 09:40 PM Re: GFI Protection
Bill Addiss Offline
Member

Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 4196
Loc: NY, USA
I would agree that they should have the protection, but if one wanted to get nit-picky, they don't seem to count as serving the countertop area. 210.8(A)(7) says that GFCI protection in Kitchens is needed "where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces"

210.52(C)(5) says that Receptacles located in Appliance garages "shall not be considered as these required outlets"

Bill

Don,
I was composing and didn't see your comment.

[This message has been edited by Bill Addiss (edited 02-23-2002).]

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#7820 - 02/23/02 04:37 AM Re: GFI Protection
Electricmanscott Offline
Member

Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 1478
Loc: Holden, MA USA
Always looking for the loophole! I like that.

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