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#75634 - 03/06/07 05:47 PM Techniques
NJ_WVUGrad Offline
Registered: 01/17/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Neptune, NJ, USA
I have picked up many tips from "old timers" and other journeymen I have worked with on working hot.

Now...hold on...from this point forward in the topic we will use "As If Hot" or "working as to prevent injury if it is accidentally hot"

I really don't want to get into a flame war about live work - as this is not intent of the post.

We are in the demo phase of a supermarket renovation on my job and this topic crossed my mind while cutting loose a lot of 3-phase 220V outlets in advance of the demo crew coming in.

Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
#75635 - 03/06/07 08:49 PM Re: Techniques
Gregtaylor Offline
Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 212
Loc: Boise, Idaho, USA
What's the question?
#75636 - 03/07/07 03:12 AM Re: Techniques
NJ_WVUGrad Offline
Registered: 01/17/06
Posts: 47
Loc: Neptune, NJ, USA
Wow...thanks...forgot to ask the question

What are the best tips that you have gotten for safely handling conductors.

I.E. working one at a time, neutral or hot - safely flipping a breaker/switch etc, bringing a service back on line etc

I just see alot of people who have no clue on this - and figure well its dead so it doesn't matter. But you never know...

What tips have stuck with you...
#75637 - 03/07/07 05:08 AM Re: Techniques
ayrton Offline
Registered: 12/21/01
Posts: 201
Loc: Pa
When it cannot be avoided. (often in commercial and industrial)I do the same thing everytime.

First, since being burned in the face from an arc flash. I will not go in a hot panel w/outa face shield on. Some people give me funny looks, but they have never been burned. Ever have painfuly chapped lips? Multiply that by 10!

Any way, when disconnecting a device or circuit with a neutral (circuit is hot) always disconnect the hot wire first. Than the neutral. Reverse when assembling. The "load" hurts alot more when it whacks you!

Also, be aware of where your limbs and other parts of your body are when handling live circuits. In a ceiling for example with steel joists, dont be holding on to the steel with one hand while handling circuits in the other. COMMON sense!

The best tool I ever bought, was a quality cicuit tracer. I use it everyday. DO nOT trip circuits, or attempt to to find breakers. People do it all the time, because they dont understand that the one time in a 100 time u do this u could cause a fire, injury or death.

Also dont be afraid to simply say, I will not work on this Hot!

I am sure the other experienced personnel on this forum can add, with there experiences.

[This message has been edited by ayrton (edited 03-07-2007).]
#75638 - 03/07/07 05:51 AM Re: Techniques
ghost307 Offline
Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 900
Loc: Chicago Illinois USA
I'm in agreeement with Ayrton, stay out of the way of any possible blast (stand to the side), treat EVERYTHING as if it were hot, and get a good quality tester.

GE taught me to test "HOT-COLD-HOT"; it's good advice. Check your tester on something that you know is energized (to make sure it works), then test the conductors to make sure that they're dead, then go back to the energized conductors to make sure that the tester didn't pick that particular instant to break. It only takes a second and it can save your life.
#75639 - 03/07/07 06:30 AM Re: Techniques
Registered: 03/29/04
Posts: 251
Loc: Kingwood, TX USA
Before cutting hot conductors, I always use a clamp-on amp meter. Checking to see if there is a load on the conductor, neutral no exception! This will lower the chance of cutting a shared neutral or a loaded ckt. Robert
#75640 - 03/07/07 12:09 PM Re: Techniques
jay8 Offline
Registered: 07/28/05
Posts: 183
Loc: Vancouver, BC
cut one wire at a time, and never take for granted that just because it is 18 gage, or that it is control circuit, that you can just hack away at it. That control circuit may just short cycle a 400 amp chiller, cause some hammering on a 40 hp centrifugal pump etc etc.
#75641 - 03/07/07 12:58 PM Re: Techniques
yanici Offline
Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 58
Loc: Atlantis
Funny you should mention to watch out for the 18 guage wire. I found 480 volts on an 18 guage pair one time. The wire was rated 600 volts and was a control circuit. You really just never know.
#75642 - 03/07/07 02:05 PM Re: Techniques
Kenbo Offline
Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 233
Loc: Scotland
Best tool I have is the good old volt stick. Detects voltages in cores without cutting insulation and even if there is no load. As Ghost says I test the volt stick on a live circuit first to prove it works.

Never be a loan worker have people around you who know what is going on, look out for your mate and he looks out for you. Should the worst happen someone need to take charge of the situation

der Gro├čvater
#75643 - 03/07/07 04:58 PM Re: Techniques
e57 Offline
Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2876
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
Good LOTO works for the day, anything longer than that - I remove and cap all the circuits at the panel. Same goes for multiples of circuits. And definately when doing demo. Demo crews are often dumb as dirt, they'll be doing something - trip a breaker with a rot-hammer and 3 compressors on the same circuit then go through all the breakers that might be off - including the ones under those silly red things. So when I shut it off, I pull it right out of the breaker.

Oh, and good practice of working if "it might be hot" is to disconnect in the same way you should train yourself to connect things - but in reverse. >ground, nuetral, hots to connect. Then < all hots, neutral, ground to disconnect. Of course insulated tools, gloves and eye protection. Never ground yourself, even inadvertantly by the elbows, knees or especially the head, or any other part of the body. (When I was in the service - electricians were the only personel allowed to put thier hand in a pocket. But the other one had to be in a panel ) Good idea to test things one handed - get a clip for one meter lead, hard point in the other. Fluke makes a magnetic hanger for some meters, or use the clamp-on for your ammeter to hang it in the panel where you can see it.
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
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