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#74159 - 01/15/07 03:45 PM multi circuit receptacles
derater Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/02
Posts: 182
I'm finishing a 3800' home I didn't rough. Through the inspector I got a call from the Sparky that did. He has a 'candle' circuit dropped at panel to go on a timer. My understanding is that all circuits on a 'yoke' must diconnect together. The candle circuit appears in 7 areas, 8 inc. garage, 3 are bedrooms.

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#74160 - 01/15/07 04:13 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
Gregtaylor Offline
Member

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 212
Loc: Boise, Idaho, USA
That's an unknown term to me. What's a candle circuit?

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#74161 - 01/15/07 04:40 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
LK Offline

Member

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 1721
Loc: New Jersey
Could it it be this nightmare?
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5174645.html
Abstract: An electric candle comprised of an electric lamp supported on a cylindrical casing above a base, said cylindrical casing having conductive strips connected to a power supply in said base and controlled by a switch means consisted of a spring coil around a conductor, said base having a sound pick up, a sound producing means at the inside, wherein making a sound causes said sound pick up to connect the electric circuit permitting said lamp bulb and said sound producing means to give light and sound respectively; blowing a stream of current through vent holes on said lamp cap causes said switch means to cut off the electric circuit permitting said lamp bulb and said sound producing means to stop giving light or sound.

At one time we had candle circuit on a designers dwg. when we questioned what was the candle circuit, they told us it was a night light circuit for security, designer can't charge $300 for night light circuit but wow a candle circuit, now that sounds like a deal.

[This message has been edited by LK (edited 01-15-2007).]

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#74162 - 01/15/07 04:43 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
e57 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
I believe hes talking about a nightlite circuit, either way YES - if on the same yoke, they would have to have the same disconnecting means. (In residential) See section 210.4(B)

Alternatively, you could use the same circuit as the one used for the outlet, and use that "Candle Circuit" wiring as control wiring for a small relay in each box. I dont know who makes them, I have installed them like them a lot, but since that one job... have not seen them available ANYWHERE - I have looked. But it was a small contactor (120 coil) 1"X1" cube with pigtails on it. Fit right inside the device box without taking up much room in a 4S with ring.... That would solve your problem, but I don't know where you could get them....
_________________________
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

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#74163 - 01/15/07 04:46 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
derater Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/02
Posts: 182
Sorry I wasn't too clear. The circuit for each room is ALSO in the candle circuit box.(They're for decoration, usually has an electric 'candle' on the sill above.

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#74164 - 01/15/07 04:52 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
LK Offline

Member

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 1721
Loc: New Jersey
57,

Did the fire department come to the house after installation?

The one we did, it looked like the house was on fire from the outside.
Just advise the users they should let the neighbors know what they are, or they may find fire department there, if they use them as night lights.

[This message has been edited by LK (edited 01-15-2007).]

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#74165 - 01/15/07 05:01 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
e57 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
Wooo Hoo I think I found something simular to what I was looking for......
http://www.systemsensor.com/pdf/A05-0372.pdf
See the PR-1 but I believe the ones I used before had higher rating for the contacts....

derater, so what the other circuit is in the box, thats fine - you just cant have two circuits on the same "yoke" without same disconnecting means....

This way, if you have the box volume, you use the same circuit for the outlet, switched and not switched side and only use that "Candle Circuit" to trigger the relay for the switched side - that way they are not on the same yoke.... Effect is the same.... They get operated by the timer, and turn off and on.... You just may need to locate something simular with 15A contacts.

FYI the lsat time I used these was to shut off all the bath room and common lighting in a med. rise office building after hours. Someone else wired - just like you... but didn't wire for lighting controls... I used sever dozen of these to drop down to nightlighting from a single timer.
_________________________
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

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#74166 - 01/15/07 05:09 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
e57 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
Building still stands today.... That place is bomb proof rated! Poured concrete blast barrier out front.... They were only switching 2-3 amps each on what I think I remember them to be 15A motor/lighting rated contacts. Dont think those are the ones I had, but were darned simular...
_________________________
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

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#74167 - 01/15/07 05:10 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
LK Offline

Member

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 1721
Loc: New Jersey
derater,

Are they calling the visual alart for a fire alarm signal a candle circuit?

57 these may be the ones you used http://www.smarthome.com/4633.html they have the small relays you were talking about, much nicer to work with.



[This message has been edited by LK (edited 01-15-2007).]

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#74168 - 01/15/07 05:37 PM Re: multi circuit receptacles
derater Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/02
Posts: 182
Receptacles in question are ALL located under windows, meant for 'colonial' decorative fake candles, plugged into 'timed' circuit.

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