ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#71637 - 11/03/06 04:54 PM 210.8.... query....
Attic Rat Offline
Member
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 524
Loc: Bergen Co.,N.J. USA
... 210.8 states: A) Dwelling Units
(7) Laundry, Utility, and Wet Bar Sinks. GFCI protection is required for all 15 and 20A, 125V receptacles located within an arc measurement of 6 ft from the dwelling unit laundry, utility, and wet bar sink.

...does that mean the 120 volt washer and dryer circuit has to be on a GFCI as well??
I'd done this in the past and was called back numerous times because the washer motor windings would "simulate" a ground fault on start-up,... so I was told by other sparkies that it's not good to put motor loads on a GFCI because the GFCI "reads" the event as a fault and trips the device... Please advise...thanx...AR
_________________________
.."if it ain't fixed,don't break it...call a Licensed Electrician"
Top
Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
#71638 - 11/03/06 05:31 PM Re: 210.8.... query....
ShockMe77 Offline
Member
Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 821
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
Look at 210.8 (5) exception No 2.

"a duplex receptacle for two appliances"
Top
#71639 - 11/03/06 06:21 PM Re: 210.8.... query....
caselec Offline
Member
Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 558
Loc: San Jose, CA
The exception to 210.8(A)(5) don’t apply. There are no exceptions to 210.8(A)(7)

Curt
_________________________
Curt Swartz
Top
#71640 - 11/03/06 07:34 PM Re: 210.8.... query....
gfretwell Offline


Member
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9039
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
If a washing machine trips a GFCI is is broke! That is not uncommon but it is also not right.
I have a 2 foot heavy duty extension cord with the zip cord style wire. I carefully split apart the conductors so I can put my clamp on over each wire. It makes a good testing tool.
I bet you will see current spikes or just a continuous current on the center (EGC) conductor on an appliance that trips the GFCI. I use that for people who give me the old saw about refrigerators tripping GFCIs on start up. They are usually spiking ground faults the whole time they are running.
Washing machines either have damp lint in the open frame motors, water where it shouldn't be or they have damaged conductors shorting to the frame. Remember a short from neutral to ground will trip the GFCI and never trip the O/C device, spark or give any outward appearance of a problem.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell
Top
#71641 - 11/03/06 07:40 PM Re: 210.8.... query....
e57 Offline
Member
Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2876
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
Which code cycle? 2005? Wet bars for instance.... It takes an evalutuonary step.

Quote:
1999
7. Wet bar sinks. Where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces and are located within 6 ft (1.83 m) of the outside edge of the wet bar sink. Receptacle outlets shall not be installed in a face-up position in the work surfaces or countertops.


2002
(7) Wet bar sinks — where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces and are located within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside edge of the wet bar sink.


2005 just says "Laundry, Utility, and Wet Bar Sinks. Nothing about countertops.... Hmmmm.... Y'all might be SOL.... Glad I'm not on that code cycle....
_________________________
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason
Top
#71642 - 11/03/06 08:12 PM Re: 210.8.... query....
gfretwell Offline


Member
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9039
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
Yup, on the 2005 code you either need a long cord or you will be putting the washer on a GFCI. I suppose the installers could put the laundry outlet 61" from the sink. This also does not apply to a laundry that only has a standpipe for the washer drain.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell
Top
#71643 - 11/04/06 12:11 AM Re: 210.8.... query....
resqcapt19 Offline
Member
Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2148
Loc: IL
Just wait for the 2008 code...all of the exceptions are gone except for the snow melting/deicing one and the basement one for fire/burglar alarms. Note this is based on the ROP and could change, but I doubt it.
Don
_________________________
Don(resqcapt19)
Top
#71644 - 11/04/06 04:36 AM Re: 210.8.... query....
ShockMe77 Offline
Member
Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 821
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
If using GFCI protection for a laundy circuit/ receptacle meets 2005 code, then inspectors around here certainly are NOT enforcing it.
Top
#71645 - 11/04/06 04:54 AM Re: 210.8.... query....
Trick440 Offline
Member
Registered: 08/15/05
Posts: 247
Loc: Waterford, MI, USA
Ya you wouldn't GFCI the laundry plug.

As far as I'm concerned its a dedicated circuit.


..err, even though I will jump from the laundry plug to hit an additiona plug in the laundry room sometimes... and if its within 6' from a sink I Gfci protect it...

So I have nothing to support this off the top of my head, but I do know that I think its rediculas to gfci protect a laundry plug.

[This message has been edited by Trick440 (edited 11-04-2006).]
_________________________
Shake n Bake
Top
#71646 - 11/04/06 05:28 AM Re: 210.8.... query....
Luketrician Offline
Member
Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 272
Loc: Sale Creek, TN USA
Here in Chattanooga Tn they are certainly not enforcing it either Shock', when I wired up my new house this past june, everything passed without a hitch. Washer is on a dedicated 20a bc. No gfci protection.
_________________________
Luke Clarke
Electrical Planner for TVA.

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Member Spotlight
Member Since: 07/05/02
Posts: 8211
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box


Who's Online
0 registered (), 49 Guests and 8 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
 
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
 
Top Posters (30 Days)
Admin 47
HotLine1 43
gfretwell 19
Ruben Rocha 12
Trumpy 9
 
Newest Members
Scotto, Freecrowder, clee512, Jdscott2005, FAIZAN

ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals