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#60438 - 01/02/06 04:09 PM 3 wire or 4?
scjohn Offline
Member

Registered: 07/04/02
Posts: 76
Loc: charleston, SC, USA
On a single phase residential service, no disco, do you pull a 3 wire service entrance or a 4? I always thought that the panel or disc. was the first stop, allowing you to use the 3, and any other sub after that required the 4 wires.
Thanks, John

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#60439 - 01/02/06 04:12 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
Tom Offline
Member

Registered: 01/01/01
Posts: 1069
Loc: Shinnston, WV USA
If I'm reading your post correctly (that may be doubtful) you would run 3 conductors to the service disconnecting means. After that, any feeders must have an equipment ground (4th wire or metal conduit).

Tom
_________________________
Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example.

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#60440 - 01/02/06 04:25 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
scjohn Offline
Member

Registered: 07/04/02
Posts: 76
Loc: charleston, SC, USA
You read it right. In this case there is only a 200 amp meter, and a 200 amp main breaker in the panel box, no 'knife' switch. We have always ran 3 wires from the meter directly to the panel in this case when there was no disco between the two.

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#60441 - 01/02/06 05:17 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
e57 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/27/03
Posts: 2837
Loc: S.F.,CA USA
Local POCO won't allow a ground wire between the two, just a properly bonded conduit in RMC.
_________________________
Mark Heller
"Well - I oughta....." -Jackie Gleason

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#60442 - 01/02/06 05:20 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
Speedy Petey Offline
Member

Registered: 08/29/03
Posts: 175
Loc: Upstate, NY
Exactly. You absolutley don't want a ground between the meter and main.
_________________________
Speedy Petey

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new." -Albert Einstein

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#60443 - 01/02/06 05:43 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
scjohn Offline
Member

Registered: 07/04/02
Posts: 76
Loc: charleston, SC, USA
Is there any article in the nec refering to this? I can't find it.
Thanks again.
John

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#60444 - 01/03/06 05:15 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
ShockMe77 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 823
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
Article 250 would be a likely starting place.

Start here: http://www.mikeholt.com/freevideo.php?id=GVB2005

Good luck!

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#60445 - 01/03/06 06:18 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
scjohn Offline
Member

Registered: 07/04/02
Posts: 76
Loc: charleston, SC, USA
Thanks, thats a great site. To bad my internet is running like dial up, and has been for the last few days. I guess to sum it up, is there any new revisions, or any thing wrong with runninga 3 wire seu with a bare grounded conductor from the meter base to the panel box with a main breaker? I bidded on these houses, and now the inspector says I have to run a 4 wire ser cable, almost twice the cost per foot. I would then need to seperate the ground wires from the neutral wires in the panel box to keep from a parrallel.
John

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#60446 - 01/03/06 07:25 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
Speedy Petey Offline
Member

Registered: 08/29/03
Posts: 175
Loc: Upstate, NY
If this is a typical "riser -to meter -to main panel" setup your inspector is nuts.
Ask him where exactly he expects you to terminate the extra wire.
_________________________
Speedy Petey

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new." -Albert Einstein

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#60447 - 01/04/06 03:54 PM Re: 3 wire or 4?
ShockMe77 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 823
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
I could be wrong (it wouldn't be the first time), but it seems that inspector wants you to use the 4-wire because the 200amp main panel isn't at the nearest point of entrance as required by article 230.70 (A) (1).

Also, the grounded conductor isn't the bare conductor, that's the bonding conductor. The grounded conductor is commonly referred to as the neutral conductor.

You will have to install a service disconnect (main disconnect) at the nearest point of entry, or beneath the meter on the outside of the house. This is where your GEC (article 250.66) EGC (article 250.122), and GROUNDED conductor (article 200) from the POCO will all be bonded together to create a solidly grounded electrical system.

I hope I have helped.

Good luck!

--Ron

[This message has been edited by ShockMe77 (edited 01-04-2006).]

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