ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#38931 - 06/06/04 10:46 AM Am I right or not?
Edward Offline
Member
Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 308
Loc: California
Hello folks,
I have a commercial toaster. Name plate rating:
208V Singlephase
27 Amps
Running amps 28.5 Amps

If i put a breaker rated at 30 Amps it will break because the toaster runs 11 hours a day. If I go 125% of the rating then the breaker goes to 35Amps. But the lead wires from the toaster are only 10AWG.

What i have on there now is SO cord with 30Amp twistlock receptacle and 30Amp twistlock plug.

What should i do to be within NEC?

Regards,
Edward
_________________________
Thanks
Edward
Top
Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
#38932 - 06/06/04 10:51 AM Re: Am I right or not?
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4391
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
You can not protect a 30 amp outlet with more than 30 amps.

The manufacture has installed a 30 amp cord cap, I would run a 30 amp circuit to this and not even worry about it.

It may not draw 28 amps continuously, it may cycle on and off as the thermostat dictates.
_________________________
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Top
#38933 - 06/06/04 11:03 AM Re: Am I right or not?
John Steinke Offline
Member
Registered: 04/03/01
Posts: 518
Loc: Reno,Nv., USA
I can only reccomend SO cord and a plug if the toaster is often moved around.
If that is the case, you will want to upgrade to 8/3 SO. You'll also want to use a 40 amp connector into a receptacle that is rated to disconnect under load- most of your NEMA-pattern receptacles are not. Look into such things that are marketed for motors.

It is more likely that the toaster doesn't move around very much. It would be more common that it would be wired to a disconnect switch using a metal-lined liquid-tight flex, containing #8 wires.

One exception: it is permitted to use whatever type of cord & plug that the unit came with when manufactured. I suggest looking at the makers' web site to see if there are any reccomendations.
Top
#38934 - 06/06/04 11:30 AM Re: Am I right or not?
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4391
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
John I have never hardwired these types of items in commercial kitchens.

Usually (hopefully) they are moved for cleaning not to mention the need for a disconnect.

The commercial toasters I have seen are factory fitted with 10 cord, these units have a moving metal belt that brings the toast under the elements.

This could be different in this case but if it comes with a 30 amp cord and you change it out in order to up the OCP I believe you have a UL violation.

If it was UL listed for 30 amp OCP a 35 or 40 amp OCP would be a problem.
_________________________
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Top
#38935 - 06/06/04 02:20 PM Re: Am I right or not?
Edward Offline
Member
Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 308
Loc: California
iwire,

the unit does not come with cord.(according to the owner). Here is what happened:

The original cord was burnt due to loose connection. Then i come in and replace it with a 6/3 range cord to match the existing 50Amp wall plug. Then the unit goes out for cleaning and the cleaning/repair shop tells the owner that is the wrong dryer cord.(yes they said it was a dryer cord). So they replaced the cord with a SO 10/3 with a 30amp twistlock plug. So i had to replace the existing 50Amp wall receptacle with a 30Amp receptacle to match the cord end that was put on by the repair shop.

So i do not know who is right and can not find the manufacturer's website so i can download some instructions.

Manufacturer. HOLMAN COOKING EQUIPMENT model# MM14

Edward
_________________________
Thanks
Edward
Top
#38936 - 06/06/04 02:43 PM Re: Am I right or not?
Edward Offline
Member
Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 308
Loc: California
The owner has three units for two restaurants the one that went out for cleaning was the one that i had a 6/3 range cord on.

Edward
_________________________
Thanks
Edward
Top
#38937 - 06/06/04 02:47 PM Re: Am I right or not?
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4391
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
Well that changes my outlook entirely.
_________________________
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
Top
#38938 - 06/06/04 03:14 PM Re: Am I right or not?
frank Offline
Member
Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 374
Loc: windsor ontario canada
What does UL say about it. Would it void UL listing I wouldn't touch the appliance. If its commercial does it have a max fuse size listed, is the SO factory. I would look at the nameplate and factory cord size. Maybe up the feeder size after calculating the length of run but still keep the 30a brk recept and factory cord. Why use 125% is it there an inductive load to?If it's got a 30a line cord and trips a 30a brk it is a sign that there’s something wrong like low volts or leakage to ground(which can kill) by not tripping a 40a brk near as fast as a 30a if at all which brings me back to the UL question. I always Check for ground potential (chassis to chassis) with all metal objects in reach of my kitchen installations
Top
#38939 - 06/06/04 03:19 PM Re: Am I right or not?
stamcon Offline
Member
Registered: 03/24/01
Posts: 329
Loc: So San Francisco CA
Edward, here is a link for Holman-
http://www.holmancooking.com/fs_default.asp

steve
Top
#38940 - 06/06/04 03:26 PM Re: Am I right or not?
frank Offline
Member
Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 374
Loc: windsor ontario canada
I that case they would all get 30a line cords brk recps ect according to the nameplate VALUES if it were me I might even call the manufacurer.
Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >

Member Spotlight
Member Since: 12/24/00
Posts: 4259
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box


Who's Online
0 registered (), 94 Guests and 10 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
 
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
 
Top Posters (30 Days)
Admin 47
HotLine1 43
gfretwell 19
Ruben Rocha 12
Trumpy 9
 
Newest Members
Freecrowder, clee512, Jdscott2005, FAIZAN, Regitest2

ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals