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#3050 - 08/03/01 05:33 PM Customer Q
sparky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
Why can't i run my home @ 480V 3ph like a factory? Won't i save $$$, that's why they do it right?


I've had this Q repetively and am wondering how the rest of you field it


[This message has been edited by sparky (edited 08-03-2001).]

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#3051 - 08/03/01 07:43 PM Re: Customer Q
Anonymous
Unregistered


Do you work in an industrial area?

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#3052 - 08/04/01 12:29 AM Re: Customer Q
glenn35 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/21/01
Posts: 48
[QUOTE]Originally posted by sparky:
[B]Why can't i run my home @ 480V 3ph like a factory? Won't i save $$$, that's why they do it right?


I've had this Q repetively and am wondering how the rest of you field it



Never had anyone ask that but here are few reasons of why not that I can think of.

480 3Ø was designed for heavy power. 277/480 was designed for heavy power/ heavy lighting. Residential areas don't need such power.

They would have to buy/maintain a stepdown trans. Would have to worry about there A/C single phasing if one leg was out. The cost of such an installation would be prohibitive to the savings involved if any. A utility is not going to provide 480 to a residence. There again the cost would also be prohibitive to the utility because the revenue generated from that customer would take a long time to pay for installation and maintenance. 480 fires(faults) don't just go out. They keep burning.

Well theres a few ideas you can throw at them next time they ask.

If I think of more I'll let ya know.

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#3053 - 08/04/01 01:12 AM Re: Customer Q
Scott35 Offline

Broom Pusher and
Member

Registered: 10/19/00
Posts: 2724
Loc: Anaheim, CA. USA
I've been thrown that one a bunch of times too. Most of the time they're under the impression that their power bill would be 1/4 the price, since 480 volts draws 1/4 the current of 120 volts - that's when I take a deep breath and collect my thoughts
Sure would like to find the guy / guys spreading this trash and send them back to their Planet of origin

So, after covering the 'ol "wattage is wattage" scenario to some degree, the next Q is almost always the "Why can't I have 480 VAC 3 Ph at my house?", with the trailing addendum Q of "That's why big companies use it, right?"

Since this is a no-win situation to explain and by this time your set up for failure, because you are not copletely agreeing with the bunk baloney - plus you have unknowingly insulted the person's tech mentor [cross out tech mentor and add the person[s] responsible for spreading the bull poo-poo electrical tech], here's one way to settle it concisely.

Give them these examples:
1:Industries use high horsepower machines which are normally running all day, night, or both.
2: Those loads are commonly located over 100 feet [wire length] from the service equipment - not to mention the transformer,
3: They pay the same as any customer - KWHs! [unless bad PF penalties are included, then they pay MORE!!!],
4: Not very many 480 VAC television sets, VCRs, Home Audio Systems, Refrigerators [residential use], PC power supplies, Vacuum sweepers, decorative lights, residential washers/dryers/irons, hair blow dryers, [you get the hint] are made that I know about. Typically when someone plugs these devices directly into 480 VAC, they run for a minimal time before all the smoke flows out of it - then someone has to sweep up the smoke!
5: 120 VAC is already a high enough voltage to ground for me! Maybe daredevils, thrill seekers and stunt persons with death wishes would enjoy living around a higher voltage to ground, not me.
6: Equipment for systems above 150 VAC to ground / 300 VAC L-L is large and expensive,
7: I could never run the amount of equipment at one time which would benifit from a 480 VAC system [nor could I afford to buy it],
8: The only thing I would have which uses 3 phase power would be a CNC machine, or maybe a big as* surfacer! Once again, there's not too many 3 phase hair blow dryers used in the common person's home,
9: The Utility company's Design Engineers would be laughing so hard at this request for a residence, they would certainy distribute an interoffice/WAN E-Mail joke message to the entire staff about this, and include your name, customer info, plus a possible picture [real photo or cartoon].

Some of these examples are extreme, but gives you enough "ammo" to fire back with.

It can be easilly summed up in one word: "Why???"

Scott SET
_________________________
Scott " 35 " Thompson
Just Say NO To Green Eggs And Ham!

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#3054 - 08/04/01 02:03 AM Re: Customer Q
sparky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
lol!
good posts!
i have not found a one sentence comback myself....

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#3055 - 08/04/01 02:21 PM Re: Customer Q
Tom Offline
Member

Registered: 01/01/01
Posts: 1069
Loc: Shinnston, WV USA
Most of the time, I tell them they are paying for power, which I describe to them as amps times volts (I know better, but they don't). When you double the voltage the current drops in half & the answer remains the same.

If I'm feeling cantankerous, I tell them it's a Republican conspiracy to keep the working man down while he subsidizes big business electrical rates.
_________________________
Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example.

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#3056 - 08/04/01 05:36 PM Re: Customer Q
sparky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
ouch!

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#3057 - 09/02/01 08:03 AM Re: Customer Q
bordew Offline
Member

Registered: 08/27/01
Posts: 155
Loc: Vienna,Ohio, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by sparky:
Why can't i run my home @ 480V 3ph like a factory? Won't i save $$$, that's why they do it right?


I've had this Q repetively and am wondering how the rest of you field it

I live in a very rural area but right up the street past our one signal is a single residence with three transformers on his pole feeding exactly one house. What he has in there is anybodys guess.
What I tell them and now especially with this stupid de-regulation, is that OE would charge you an arm and a leg just to put the transformers up plus reconnection and a three phase meter.
Earlier this summer I relocated a service for a customer. The power company had to install a new pole that was $1500.00, install a new transformer 550. and then run new triplex from the xfr to the new pole and then to the mast that was another 550.00
Now they tell me that for a revamp with a 4 day waiting period their reconnection charge will be a flat 200.00. From what I can see its only going to get worse.
[This message has been edited by sparky (edited 08-03-2001).]

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#3058 - 09/17/01 07:23 PM Re: Customer Q
bordew Offline
Member

Registered: 08/27/01
Posts: 155
Loc: Vienna,Ohio, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by bordew:


The cost would be prohibitive, if no 3-phase is in the area, they,in my case OE would have to install the three xfmrs, and special permission would have to be given as far as I know, residential doesnt have any 3-phase loads, any 240 volt equipment would not run as effieciently on 208 as on 240, ie water heaters, AC would have to be special, it just isnt practical to use 3-phase in residential.
As I said up the street from there is one home that has three xfmers and one 4-wire service going to the house, how they got it I havnt a clue, because it is very unusual.

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#3059 - 09/18/01 04:18 AM Re: Customer Q
Redsy Offline
Member

Registered: 03/28/01
Posts: 2138
Loc: Bucks County PA
 Quote:
Originally posted by bordew:
As I said up the street from there is one home that has three xfmers and one 4-wire service going to the house, how they got it I havnt a clue, because it is very unusual.

I understand some of these larger houses being built these days are getting 3 ph services

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