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#23450 - 03/19/03 08:06 AM Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
Redsy  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,056
Bucks County PA
I am going to start another hot topic...

Seeing the "House next door" post, I would like to say one should remove the jacket fron NM cables prior to insertion into the box. This permits visual inspection of the insulation for damage. I know the "new breed" method is to stuff the whole cable in and stick a utility knife up into the box and score the jacket then pull it off. I have debated this with several young residential guys. I have also seen slits in the insulation perfectly in line with the jacket line. The last time, I experienced a short while adjusting a receptacle. Guess what the cause was? I now insist that anyone who works with me prep the cable beforehand. I will not live with the question of whether or not my wires are sizzling behind someones bedroom wall.

Bring it on!! [Linked Image]


Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades

#23451 - 03/19/03 08:44 AM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
txsparky  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 552
Magnolia,.Texas U.S.A.
Im with you all the way Redsy. I strip before they go into the box(seems easier to me),and make up the joints as each box is completed.Pretwisting Of Course! [Linked Image]


Donnie

#23452 - 03/19/03 08:45 AM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
Big A  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 46
Lynchburg, VA
Hello Redsy,

The only problem that I would have with this is the fact that you need the jacket in the "clip" or squeeze connector to be code compliant. Otherwise I like the concept and if you take a little time, you could strip the jacket just right to work with the "clip".

I also install receptacles with the ground up, but sorry, I don't pre-twist.


#23453 - 03/19/03 09:46 AM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
ElectricAL  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 597
Minneapolis, MN USA
I agree, Redsy,

Cut generously to length allowing enough scrap to use for pigtails during makeup, strip the sheath and insert into the box.
[Linked Image]
For resi work, I'm partial to the Klein #1412 "One-Tool-Does-It-All". Cuts the cable, cuts the sheath in one squeeze, strips the conductor, bends loops - good for 14/2 & 12/2 NM.

[This message has been edited by ElectricAL (edited 03-19-2003).]


Al Hildenbrand

#23454 - 03/19/03 05:38 PM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
electrician02125  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 89
I'm with Redsy.

The klein 1412 romex tool is a must have for residential. This tool will pay for itself real fast.

I always remove the sheath before landing in the box for wire inspection and arrangement purposes.

I also arrange my conductors beforehand so they line up nice once landed inside the box (whites next to whites, blacks next to blacks.....) I usually have to flip the romex somewhere before it enters the box to accomplish this but you'll never see that once the walls are closed.


#23455 - 03/19/03 05:58 PM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
sparky  Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,303
I used to study the methods of all those that i worked under as an apprentice and J-man.
I still do, and identify the nomenclature of most of my local counterparts.

I like to wire so that it will outlive me, which takes more time in general that the 'new breed speed jockeys'

Those who rough out by just stuffing unstripped RX in boxes spend more time messing with it for trim out anyways, all that this really serves is to 'beat the rocker'


#23456 - 03/19/03 07:50 PM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
Fred  Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 449
Straughn, IN 47387
I strip the jacket, twist the bare grounds and install a "greenie" and roll up the wires real good and as far back in the box as possible to avoid the rotozip bit. When it's time for pluggin' and switchin' it goes real fast. If it's a GFCI that feeds down stream receptacles I strip about 1/2" off of the ends of the "line" pair in the box. I do the same thing to the home run in the first receptacle box it hits. I also mark the floor in front of the home run boxes with red paint in case the GC needs an outlet heated up early for lights or a heater to help dry the mud.


#23457 - 03/19/03 09:28 PM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
HotLine1  Offline


Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,803
Brick, NJ USA
Redsy & all:
I hate to rain on the parade of the "new breed", but they would not pass a "rough" inspection here.
RX sheath has to be off, grounds spliced thru w/tail. The other "splices & tails" are optional, unless it's a multi-wire circuit.

BTW guys, I'm with you...my guys make up all the splices/tails for rough. We do the paint on the floor thing too.

John


John

#23458 - 03/19/03 11:01 PM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
Electric Eagle  Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 914
Alpharetta, GA
Hotline,
I think you missunderstand what the "new breed" does. They push the RX in the box, then take a box cutter and score the sheathing, pull off the sheathing and make the taps as normal. So the box is ready to go for rough inspection.

I resisted this "style" of wiring for a long time, but now have move to the dark side myself. This is now the method we encourage. We have seen too much damage from prestripping the old way by twisting the wire in your strippers. On several occassions we had new helpers completely cut through a conductor or 2. The new method does not harm the conductors or inner sheathing.

Pretwist if 3 or more wires, ground down.

[This message has been edited by Electric Eagle (edited 03-19-2003).]


#23459 - 03/21/03 12:21 AM Re: Pre-twist, Ground up, and...  
arseegee  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 324
Statesboro, GA USA
Gotta go with eagle on this one. All cables in the box first, stapled up and then stripped. I check all the time to make sure NO conductors are nicked. Had a guy back in 98 screw up some wires with one of those klein romex strippers. Ever since i have not allowed those things on the job. We pulled 19K ft of 12/2 since March 10th. Speed does count but a safe installation is top priority.

More than two wires - pre twist.
Grounds down... (unless specs call for grounds up)


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