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#22373 - 02/21/03 06:55 PM Service Panels
Anonymous
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I have a good question. If a person wants to replace their old fuse panel-with a breaker panel. Do you have to run new wire? How about the service feed? I need answers, because I'm curious. I haven't ran across an old panel in many many years, so my clarification of its looks are "none".
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#22374 - 02/21/03 07:03 PM Re: Service Panels
Elzappr Offline
Member
Registered: 12/20/01
Posts: 270
Loc: Oregon
Well, I've done a lot of west coast service changes, and a lot of the old services were only 60 Amp services. I usually installed 125 Amp breaker panels, a new riser, meter base and SE conductors, and new ground system. Usually some of the branch circuits would have to be j-boxed, in order to accomodate the new breaker panel. Old wire doesn't stretch very good. Nice one day job! Love to do service changes!
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#22375 - 02/21/03 07:04 PM Re: Service Panels
Crowbar Offline
Member
Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 33
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA,USA
I'd only consider replacing the entire service since if the fuse box needs upgrading then the rest of the system should follow suit.
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#22376 - 02/21/03 09:54 PM Re: Service Panels
frenchelectrican Offline
Member
Registered: 02/06/03
Posts: 939
Loc: Wi/ Paris France { France for ...
i done alot of upgrading from old 60 amps box to modren 100 or 150 amps boxes it is very typically i do is put new meter socket new oh or ug wires setup and i make a thru inspection of exsting wires to make sure they can usebale with meet the codes and it is very common for me to rewire the kitchen and bathroom wires ( those wire are the first to go !!!!) due all the hevey load on the line some case i see old box with 30 amp with multi 14 ga wires that is very spooky that why i check it very carefull to make sure there is no burn or overload telltale signs and replace other items as need. genreally a full day some case 2 depend on how much mess it is involved

merci marc
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#22377 - 02/22/03 04:38 PM Re: Service Panels
Elzappr Offline
Member
Registered: 12/20/01
Posts: 270
Loc: Oregon
Frenchelectrican, your comments about inspecting the old wiring brings to mind a common problem with service changes. After years of oversized fusing (using 30 amp fuses for #14 wire), after the service change is done the customer invariably overloads some circuits. I guess it would be good to inspect, and advise the customer about upgrading the circuitry first, so that the customer can know better about what the project will actually entail.
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#22378 - 02/22/03 04:54 PM Re: Service Panels
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4391
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
We did service changes on 12, 5 story 30 unit apartment buildings right near Fenway Park. We were contracted to put in the new service and that was it, each unit had 1 #14 "riser" from the basement when we got there each units riser had a 30 amp glass Edison base fuse, when we would leave they would have a single pole 15 amp breaker. Right away these were tripping, to no surprise the floor was littered with blown 30 amp fuses.

I do not know what happened when we were gone because we got our inspection and moved on.

So for the residents it would be hair dryer or coffee maker but not both!
Bob
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Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
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#22379 - 02/22/03 04:57 PM Re: Service Panels
ga.sparky56 Offline
Member
Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 558
Loc: young harris georgia usa
Marc brings up a good point.A lot of times the branch ckts are in worse shape than the service,and should be looked at closely.Russell
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#22380 - 02/22/03 05:16 PM Re: Service Panels
n1ist Offline
Member
Registered: 02/13/02
Posts: 183
Loc: Malden MA
iwire - you forgot to mention that the 14ga was cloth covered (at least where I used to live in Brighton). 5V drop when I turned on the toaster, and I kept worrying that someone would want toast and coffee at the same time one morning...
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#22381 - 02/22/03 05:21 PM Re: Service Panels
Electricmanscott Offline
Member
Registered: 01/12/02
Posts: 1457
Loc: Holden, MA USA
I wire, I have been down that road before. MANY buildings in the Boston area with that setup. One of my first jobs as a helper was in a 60+ unit building in Somerville. New service, new 60 amp panels to each apt, and new a/c and kitchen outlets all while still occupied. Quite a job. Foca Se, do you mean the feeder to the panel or the branch wiring in the house?
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#22382 - 02/22/03 05:33 PM Re: Service Panels
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4391
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
I did this work around 1985 I can not remember for sure but I think it was K&T


Electricmanscott,
I wish we had put 60amp single phase risers in, The 800 amp 31 meter bank looked kind of strange with 30 Single pole 15s for the units and one 2 pole 100 for Public panel

Of course my 2 sets of 600kcmil feeders terminated to a #6 lead covererd underground cable assembly that Boston Edison said if it fails we will worry about it then.
Bob

[This message has been edited by iwire (edited 02-22-2003).]
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Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts
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