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#21451 - 02/03/03 02:21 PM DIY Shows
rowdyrudy Offline

Registered: 11/02/02
Posts: 171
Loc: Mascoutah, IL USA
I just saw on the Weather Channel a clip by Today's Homeowner. An exhaust fan was being installed and the demonstration detailed the romex and fan wire to be scotchlocked in the open (no box). Some of the questions and replys on the This Old House forum are also frightening.

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#21452 - 02/03/03 02:29 PM Re: DIY Shows
SvenNYC Offline

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 1685
Loc: New York City
Not quite from a TV show, but you get the idea. No GFCI in this location (cabinet underneath a bathroom sink). Imagine if one of these pipes springs a leak and sprays all over the place.

It was taken from this website:

The installer explains that the outlet is for a "hot water recirc pump"

#21453 - 02/04/03 06:28 AM Re: DIY Shows
Ron Offline

Registered: 03/13/02
Posts: 577
Loc: White Plains, NY
Regarding the recept.:
Although a GFCI under a kitchen sink might be a good idea, it is not a code requirement.
In addition, the device in the picture might be GFCI protected by a device upstream.

#21454 - 02/04/03 06:40 AM Re: DIY Shows
SvenNYC Offline

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 1685
Loc: New York City

I thought that the area under a sink would also be classified as a "damp location" considering it could be subject to drips and all...

I forgot about the upstream GFCI (the site's author never mentioned it being GFCI protected or anything).

#21455 - 02/04/03 08:23 AM Re: DIY Shows
resqcapt19 Offline

Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2209
Loc: IL
While you are correct that a receptacle in a cabinet under a kitchen sink would not require GFCI protection, the post said this was a bathroom sink. All bathroom receptacles require GFCI protection, even if under a sink.

#21456 - 02/04/03 11:10 AM Re: DIY Shows
pwood Offline

Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 64
Loc: castella,calif usa
Greetings all from a first timer,
i can't sit here and stare at that drain and trap installation without asking what's wrong with that picture?it belongs on a plumbing "how not to,bless the diy for trying "forum.receptacle $25.00,plumbing parts,$50.00,installation technique "priceless"

#21457 - 02/04/03 11:43 AM Re: DIY Shows
sparky Offline

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
greeting pwood, welcome to ECN.

we as a trade have been at odds with DYI'ers since the trade began, yet our prime motivation is simply safety.

this is usually echoed here given the amount we see that is unsafe.

so it falls on us, as ambassadors of our trade to explain to those like whom inquire.

feel free, we can use the practice.

#21458 - 02/04/03 12:12 PM Re: DIY Shows
Trainwire Offline

Registered: 03/15/02
Posts: 364
Loc: Strasburg,PA,USA
Your right! I just noticed that the trap is upside down.


#21459 - 02/04/03 12:54 PM Re: DIY Shows
ThinkGood Offline

Registered: 08/07/02
Posts: 1084
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
So is the receptacle!

#21460 - 02/04/03 01:45 PM Re: DIY Shows
SvenNYC Offline

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 1685
Loc: New York City
Your right! I just noticed that the trap is upside down.

Holy smokes Trainwire! You're right!!!

Don't you just hate traps without the cleanout plug?

P.S.: I hate doing plumbing.

What started out as a simple washer replacement, resulted in a totally new sink installation this past weekend.

First, spouse opened the faucet stems to discover the things had been forced and the threads sliced right off.

Then the leaky P-Trap under the sink was so corroded that when he went to feel for leaks, his finger went right through the pipe!!

So we pull the jammed and rotten cabinet from under the (theoretically) wall mounted sink. Realize sink is only held in place with a wood screw so it starts to come apart. We undo the pipes and take the sink off. Sink wasn't square to the wall so previous "installer" jammed a roll of newspaper sales flyer from 1979 in there (sale on 19" color TV sets). Discover that the old P-Trap was CROSS THREADED to the cast iron pipe in the wall.

Head out to Home Desperate and go out and buy a large pipe wrench and fittings, plus the new cabinet (thinking they're all standard). At leat the old trap came off without breaking the cast iron waste pipe or stripping its threads. Call mommy to schlepp us back home with the stuff in her micro-bus.

Come back home at 11:15 p.m. Find out sink doesn't fit new cabinet. Drive back to the Big Orange box - bummer. They closed at midnight. We arrived at 12:10. Crash at mommy's house.

Get up early Sunday morning and return cabinet. Take the old sink to the store to fit onto a new cabinet. No luck. Time is wasting and here I am dragging a groaty old porcelain monster in an orange cart.

Finally we go for the tiny $70 Home Desperate slumlord special with the "cultured marble" sink (it's cast resin, fer cryin'out loud). Emphasis on DESPERATE. I leave the old porcelain sink lying on the bench in front of the store I was so pissed! :P

Plus pipes, drain, fittings, etc.

Finally we got everything to go in with no problem and most importantly with no leaks last Monday night at around 10 p.m.

What was supposed to be a three-for-a-nickel simple washer replacement turned into a $100-plus job!

I think I'll stick with least it doesn't leak and spill all over the floor!!!

[This message has been edited by SvenNYC (edited 02-04-2003).]

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