The Electrical Contractor Network

ECN Electrical Forum
Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Books, Tools and Test Equipment for Electrical and Construction Trades

Register Now!

Register Now!

We want your input!

Featured:
   

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

   
Recent Posts
Correct rotation, wrong sequence
by Potseal
Today at 03:14 PM
Industrail Control Panel bonding per 409.108
by sparkyinak
Yesterday at 06:29 PM
Calling all Non-US members!! (Non-US only)
by aussie240
12/07/16 02:39 AM
Photo Upload Tutorial
by DanK
12/06/16 11:35 PM
Sprinklered equipment 26-008
by bigpapa
12/02/16 04:24 PM
New in the Gallery:
12.5A through 0.75mm˛ flex (just out of curiosity)
Shout Box

Top Posters (30 Days)
gfretwell 12
HotLine1 10
Potseal 9
sparkyinak 8
Texas_Ranger 7
Who's Online
0 registered (), 198 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#213201 - 03/29/14 11:10 AM Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur
sparkync Offline
Member

Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 811
Loc: NC
Another question concerning supporting light fixtures in suspended ceiling independantely of the grid. I know that the code says to attach light fixtures to the grid, but the requirement for tie wires is not in there ( I can't find it anyway). I know it must be in the building code or some other code. Does anyone know the "gauge" wire that is required to support them? I've looked in the North Carolina building code online, and I can't find anything about it. I've tried the "search" on the forum here but still can't find anything. I'm thinking it's a #12 steel wire, but am not sure. Thanks again...

Top
2014 / 2011 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
#213207 - 03/29/14 12:29 PM Re: Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur [Re: sparkync]
HotLine1 Offline

Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6805
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
10 or 12 ga should be OK
Check the specs if you have any for the job.

FYI, I used to have the ceiling guys install wires for me, and pay them; instead of using electricians time.


Edited by HotLine1 (03/29/14 01:48 PM)
_________________________
John

Top
#213210 - 03/29/14 03:17 PM Re: Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur [Re: sparkync]
sparkync Offline
Member

Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 811
Loc: NC
Thanks John. The reason I'm asking is that I think the owner was expecting to use little #17 gauge wire (it may be a little bigger, can't remember exactly what # was on the roll, but it was small. On a roll kinda of like # 10thhn wire is on)
I just wanted an official note of some kind to tell him. I'm sure I wouldn't want to be standing under one of the lights, if the ceiling fell with the kind of wire he has. Thanks
And yes, I'm going to get them to install the wires, but want to make sure they install the right ones. There's going to be a lot of them.

Top
#213212 - 03/29/14 03:46 PM Re: Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur [Re: sparkync]
gfretwell Offline

Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9045
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
ASTM C 636 says #12 steel
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

Top
#213214 - 03/29/14 04:28 PM Re: Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur [Re: sparkync]
HotLine1 Offline

Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6805
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Greg:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but does steel wire gauge go the same as AWG; larger number smaller diameter?

And, thanks for the standard!
_________________________
John

Top
#213216 - 03/29/14 05:04 PM Re: Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur [Re: sparkync]
Tesla Offline
Member

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 1280
Loc: Sacramento, CA
The history of wire gauges goes back into British industrial history -- and can get involved.

The original wire standard was exclusively for steel. It was devised for it. Copper wire -- for electric use came generations later.

While not exact, #12 in steel is pretty close to #12 in copper, and so forth. #10 is bigger in cross section for both, etc.

( Over a century ago, they actually were the same sizes. Then better steels caused them to re-standardize the steel gauge somewhat. Pure copper stayed copper.)


%%%

The numbering system got started by way of the technique:

A #1 (steel) wire had been drawn through the first (largest) die.

It was then annealed.

Next it was drawn through the #2 die, the second die, and it grew longer and thinner.

It was then annealed.

And so forth.

The 'oughts' ( 2/0 ) were the first attempts at back sizing upwards.

4/0 was as big as they needed, so it stopped there.


Edited by Tesla (03/29/14 05:11 PM)
_________________________
Tesla

Top
#213218 - 03/29/14 05:45 PM Re: Minimum gage tie wires for supporting light fixtur [Re: sparkync]
sparkync Offline
Member

Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 811
Loc: NC
Thanks Greg. I tried to pull up the actual document so I could reference it to the owner, but couldn't find it. I'll let him know though. I did find where North Carolina has adopted the ASTM C 636 standard back in 2006 if I read right. Thanks again... Steve

Top



ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals