The Electrical Contractor Network

ECN Electrical Forum
Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Books, Tools and Test Equipment for Electrical and Construction Trades

Register Now!

Register Now!

We want your input!

Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Recent Posts
Safety at heights?
by HotLine1
Yesterday at 08:51 PM
International Wire Colour Codes
by Texas_Ranger
Yesterday at 03:29 PM
Looking for older post
by Texas_Ranger
Yesterday at 03:22 PM
Last time to chat here
by Trumpy
01/20/17 11:41 PM
Unsafe Situations
by Trumpy
01/20/17 09:46 PM
New in the Gallery:
Desk-mounted "power-board"
Shout Box

Top Posters (30 Days)
Admin 35
HotLine1 21
Ruben Rocha 17
gfretwell 16
Trumpy 15
Who's Online
0 registered (), 66 Guests and 10 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#211018 - 09/04/13 10:01 AM GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker??
sparkync Offline
Member

Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 811
Loc: NC
I have a customer who has a house built in the 70's that has a 20 GFI breaker that feeds a lot of stuff from the house then a lot of lights down at the lake he lives next to
(Jecuzzi, path lights, boat house lights etc.). He's wanting me to add an outlet down near the lake and installing a GFI in it also. Any problems adding it on the same circuit as the breaker?? I think I've run into this before and had no problems, but can't remember. Thanks Steve..

Top
Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades

Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
Work Gear for Electricians and the Trades
Arc Flash Clothing, Gloves, KneePads, Tool Belts, Pouches, Tool Carriers, etc. etc....

#211019 - 09/04/13 10:27 AM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
sparkyinak Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/07
Posts: 1308
Loc: Alaska
It's a PIA to troubleshoot but its not a code issue. I'd recommend to the the customer go with the breaker. Less neuscience tripping and it would save hime a few dollars
_________________________
"Live Awesome!" - Kevin Carosa

Top
#211020 - 09/04/13 11:55 AM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
gfretwell Offline


Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9066
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
If there is already a GFCI breaker, you don't need another GFCI on that circuit.
I do have a few that are stacked like that but it is a cord mounted GFCI in an appliance plugged into a GFCI circuit.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

Top
#211023 - 09/04/13 07:19 PM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
HotLine1 Offline


Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6833
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
One PITA of a string of GFI devices (on load side) is hunting down the one that tripped.

Putting a regular WR duplex down by the lake, could be a life safety issue, being the OP said lights, path lights are on that circuit.

Personally, I would have the lights on a circuit, the jacuzzi on a circuit, and a circuit down by the lake. GFI protection as required.

BTW, the multiple GFI devices on the same circuit is one of the 'homeowner' specials up here

_________________________
John

Top
#211035 - 09/07/13 11:09 AM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
gfretwell Offline


Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9066
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
I am not sure why troubleshooting stacked GFCIs is harder. It should be easier. You have a better idea of which segment of wire is good or bad.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

Top
#211036 - 09/07/13 03:15 PM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
geoff in UK Offline
Member

Registered: 12/30/02
Posts: 177
Loc: UK
Its all down to trip times and device sensitivity. In a fault condition its a race between the devices and you can't predict which will go first. Hence the fault area is clear if only the one nearest the load trips, but a trip up the line and it's anyone's guess. In my opinion only time delayed units should be upstream of any others.

Top
#211037 - 09/07/13 09:10 PM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
gfretwell Offline


Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9066
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
It is still safe to assume the fault is past the last one that trips tho.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

Top
#211039 - 09/08/13 11:53 AM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
sparkyinak Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/07
Posts: 1308
Loc: Alaska
It's harder to trouble shoot per say because is is no the first thing that comes to your mind. I had once a GFCI breaker, GFCI recept and a second GFCI recept on the load side on the first recept. All is needed is one GFCI device and I place it in the most convient location in the circuit. If more then one is needed for conscience, no need to put one on the load side of another. If the customer don't know where they are all at then its gets time consuming meaning a big repair bill needlessly. Not good for a reputation.
_________________________
"Live Awesome!" - Kevin Carosa

Top
#211044 - 09/08/13 04:28 PM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: gfretwell]
Texas_Ranger Offline
Member

Registered: 12/17/01
Posts: 2351
Loc: Vienna, Austria
Originally Posted By gfretwell
It is still safe to assume the fault is past the last one that trips tho.

True, tripping a GFI from the line side is fairly hard, except for transients (e.g. lightning).

Top
#211046 - 09/08/13 05:42 PM Re: GFI outlet in conjunction with GFI breaker?? [Re: sparkync]
HotLine1 Offline


Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6833
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
As an inspector, it is a royal pain 'hunting' for a tripped GFI downstream of the one I was testing.

_________________________
John

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >


ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals