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#198408 - 01/20/11 08:37 PM checking gas bond
schenimann Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/08
Posts: 194
Loc: Western North Carolina
Hey guys

I picked up some work for a local fireplace store bonding the gas lines on installation. They have been installing them for years but only recently failed for a missing gas bond to the black pipe. I had already done several bonds for the tract pipe but apparently they had no idea that a bond is required for the black pipe. It actually works out good, now they call me on every installation to do the bond.

The black pipe can be bonded anywhere on the pipe. It may be at the service, furnace, water heater, crawl space, attic, etc. Is there a way to check for bonding that is not easily visible. Can I do a simple continuity test, hot to ground? If the pipe runs against something that is grounded, the meter would show ground but it is not truly bonded. It would still be a permit and a service call, but would save the work.

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#198411 - 01/20/11 09:56 PM Re: checking gas bond [Re: schenimann]
leland Offline
Member

Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Lowell area, Ma. USA
How are these fire places operated?
Where/what is the final gas connection?
What is the final gas termination?

If any of these items are cord and plug connected,then they are bonded thru the EGC.
If they are hard piped into a unit,that is hard wired IE: furnace,boiler etc..They are bonded thru the EGC or the water piping.

I see no need nor does the code making panel for additional bonding.

Good score for no reason. Charge accordingly.

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#198419 - 01/21/11 08:55 AM Re: checking gas bond [Re: leland]
Tesla Offline
Member

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 1280
Loc: Sacramento, CA
Ahem...

Gas line have to be boned when the utility is bringing gas in by plastic AND the metallic piping is a retrofit -- it wasn't bonded during the original construction.

Simple static electricity is enough to spark off natural gas. The last thing you want is for an unbonded pipe to build any charge under any condition.

Think lightning, vehicles driving into the home, crazy kids...

-------

The retro-fit 'fireplaces' I'm seeing are pure electric fakes. Out my way the AHJ has shut down fireplace permits.

Thusly, any home with a pre-existing fireplace pulls a premium price -- generally $5,000 per fireplace!
_________________________
Tesla

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#198439 - 01/21/11 09:25 PM Re: checking gas bond [Re: Tesla]
Obsaleet Offline
Member

Registered: 04/05/03
Posts: 361
Loc: Pa
I believe he ids talking about bonding the yellow flex pipe to the black pipe. If you are connecting this to the grounding electrode it is no longer a bond but a ground. This is a violation in most gas companies eyes. The do not want any of there piping carrying stray voltage to ground. Aloose connection gets moved and boooom!

Ob
_________________________
Choose your customers, don't let them choose you.

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#198455 - 01/22/11 03:20 PM Re: checking gas bond [Re: Obsaleet]
Tesla Offline
Member

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 1280
Loc: Sacramento, CA
Obsaleet...

OP is bonding the BLACK PIPE to the GEC system.

Read the second half of the Original Post.

BTW, that's EXACTLY the way our AHJ insists, too.
_________________________
Tesla

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#198457 - 01/22/11 04:49 PM Re: checking gas bond [Re: Tesla]
leland Offline
Member

Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Lowell area, Ma. USA
Correct me if I'm wrong,Or educate me If I missed it.

The yellow flex gas pipe is metallic inside,all fittings are metal,change over to black steel, via threaded black coupling, and pipe to fixture-furnace -heater etc.

Fixture is wired and grounded,does this not in turn bond the gas pipe?

thanx,

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#198461 - 01/23/11 09:06 AM Re: checking gas bond [Re: leland]
Tesla Offline
Member

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 1280
Loc: Sacramento, CA
Leland...

Perhaps so.

But what if the building's occupant doesn't install an appliance?

In such a case you've got a building with gas in black pipe terminated in a nipple and ball valve -- not bonded to the building.

My AHJ will not accept some cheezy EGC to bond the black pipe to the GEC. Instead it must be a massive conductor sized like the water bond and structural bond.

That's not as tough as it seems. The gas SERVICE is right next to the water SERVICE. So it is but a small matter to jumper them together.
_________________________
Tesla

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#198462 - 01/23/11 09:29 AM Re: checking gas bond [Re: schenimann]
Niko Offline
Member

Registered: 08/17/06
Posts: 358
Loc: Campbell, CA
Originally Posted By: schenimann
Is there a way to check for bonding that is not easily visible. Can I do a simple continuity test, hot to ground? If the pipe runs against something that is grounded, the meter would show ground but it is not truly bonded.


If you do a simple continuity check it will probably read that is connected to a grounded body. However, it may be just TOUCHING the water pipe. The easiest way which i am sure you already know, is connect the cold/gas/hot pipes at the water heater which can be visually verified.

Some of local AHJ require bonding of the gas pipe with at least a #6.
_________________________
Be kind to your neighbor, he knows where you live


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#198465 - 01/23/11 11:12 AM Re: checking gas bond [Re: Tesla]
leland Offline
Member

Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Lowell area, Ma. USA
Thank you Tesla,

I have never run into this situation in my area.
But do understand the issue better now.I will be more observant.

I do however,bond the duct work (with #10) between the AH and the flex-transition to building duct- (resi),not all flex though,as I probably should.

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#198468 - 01/23/11 12:10 PM Re: checking gas bond [Re: leland]
leland Offline
Member

Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Lowell area, Ma. USA
Now that I think about it... Hurts my lil' brain-

My theory of the EGC bonding,how about the appliance (stove etc) that is 3 wire- that bond is actually a grounded conductor....

Now I got a headache. frown


Edited by leland (01/23/11 12:11 PM)

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