The Electrical Contractor Network

ECN Electrical Forum
Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Books, Tools and Test Equipment for Electrical and Construction Trades

Register Now!

Register Now!

We want your input!

Featured:
   

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

   
Recent Posts
Temporarily feeding a panel...
by HotLine1
Today at 07:07 PM
Locked rotor, no burnout
by jraef
Today at 01:18 PM
Massive power outage South Australia
by Meadow
Today at 06:46 AM
short circuit??
by Meadow
Today at 06:43 AM
Norwegian power?
by Meadow
Today at 06:36 AM
New in the Gallery:
12.5A through 0.75mm˛ flex (just out of curiosity)
Shout Box

Top Posters (30 Days)
HotLine1 14
sparky 10
gfretwell 8
sparky66wv 8
Vlado 6
Who's Online
0 registered (), 276 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#197559 - 12/07/10 09:23 AM Parking Lot Pipe
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5300
Loc: Blue Collar Country
I'd like to describe an installation I saw yesterday, and get your thoughts. I apologize for not having pics, but I'll try to be clear.

The location was a small store, with paved parking completely around the little building. Out at streetside was a pole-mounted sign.

Power to the sign was provided by a circuit run in RMC. The RMC was simply laid atop the asphalt - no straps or anchors. Then the RMC was paved over, sort of.

The new pavement extended about four feet on either side of the pipe, and tapered from the existing parking lot to the top of the pipe. The finished result was an asphalt ramp on either side of the pipe, and the top of the pipe exposed to the sky.

To be fair to the paving crew, you did not notice these ramps when either driving or walking over the pipe. The location is such that a LOT of traffic goes directly over the pipe - yet there is no sign of damage to the pipe.

Would you consider this a proper install? Is the pipe 'supported' as required? What are your thoughts?

Top
2014 / 2011 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
#197560 - 12/07/10 12:33 PM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: renosteinke]
HotLine1 Offline

Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6786
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Reno:

A clear violation of 300.5 & a red tag.

As to support, I guess the blacktop kind of keeps the pipe in place, but again it's not compliant. I've seem RGC kind of tuched away against a concrete curb, strapped to the curbing, and surronded by debris, but it was a repair that was not permitted or inspected.

I also came upon 3" RGC that was set into a 'speed bump' and the irrigation guy used it for a raceway to cross a private road. LOL!

BTW, I think you could drive a semi accross what you describe, with no damage to the RGC, as long as the blacktop holds up

That's my two cents.
_________________________
John

Top
#197571 - 12/07/10 07:07 PM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: HotLine1]
frenchelectrican Offline

Member

Registered: 02/06/03
Posts: 938
Loc: Wi/ Paris France { France for ...
I will never allow that kind of installment like that and it will be automatique red tag no question asked.

I know I did recall couple spot in Wisconsin some guys got nailed pretty hard and have to tear the blacktop out.

The reason the inspector stated that the blacktop is pretty protisus { bunch of tiny holes } when you get water in there and frezze up it can do funny things below of it.

And the other key reason why that inspector red tagged due the conduit is only 4 inch below top of blacktop and it do get pretty hot in summer time.

I think someone try to find a excuse to not to dig down half meter deep.

Merci,
Marc
_________________________
Pas de problme,il marche n'est-ce pas?"(No problem, it works doesn't it?)


Top
#197573 - 12/07/10 07:14 PM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: frenchelectrican]
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5300
Loc: Blue Collar Country
It appears that this installation is so ... unique .... that I'll have to get some pics tomorrow. I don't think you can cite 300.5, as the pipe is most definitely not buried.

Stay tuned ...

Top
#197575 - 12/07/10 07:19 PM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: renosteinke]
frenchelectrican Offline

Member

Registered: 02/06/03
Posts: 938
Loc: Wi/ Paris France { France for ...
I will be waiting for that photo.,,,

Merci.
Marc
_________________________
Pas de problme,il marche n'est-ce pas?"(No problem, it works doesn't it?)


Top
#197579 - 12/07/10 09:02 PM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: frenchelectrican]
gfretwell Offline

Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 9012
Loc: Estero,Fl,usa
If the pipe is under the surface, it is buried.
The only thing that gets you a break is "concrete"
Any other material is just "cover" whether it is dirt, gravel, sand or asphalt.
It would be tougher to prove he couldn't just run it on the surface.
_________________________
Greg Fretwell

Top
#197584 - 12/07/10 09:41 PM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: gfretwell]
Tesla Offline
Member

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 1280
Loc: Sacramento, CA
That's a failed install...

Traffic'd raceways need to be 24" cover even if they are low voltage runs.

I've seen a California job by illegal immigrant 'electricians' ( couldn't even speak halting English ) wherein they notched the concrete and asphalt - then laid in Schedule 40 PVC and pulled their circuits. A slight film of concrete buried their handicraft.

However, since the location was a Heavy-Duty Long Haul Truck Stop -- somehow I expect those circuits to fail.

As you might imagine the ENTIRE overhaul was un-permitted work. The owners were illegal immigrants, too -- this time from Turkey.
_________________________
Tesla

Top
#197592 - 12/08/10 07:26 AM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: Tesla]
harold endean Offline
Member

Registered: 02/16/02
Posts: 2248
Loc: Boonton, NJ
John,

Take this scene, with a twist. Someone wants to run an underground service from pole to house. There is a lot of ledge rock and you can't dig deeper than 1 foot. Can you lay the pipe on the ledge rock, cover it with concrete, then put either dirt or pavement over it and still be code compliant?

Top
#197593 - 12/08/10 07:42 AM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: harold endean]
HotLine1 Offline

Member

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6786
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Harold:
IMHO, it will work, however....pole to house (Lateral) may be under jurisdiction of the POCO. As AHJ in that area, it's your call.
_________________________
John

Top
#197595 - 12/08/10 09:40 AM Re: Parking Lot Pipe [Re: HotLine1]
Niko Offline
Member

Registered: 08/17/06
Posts: 358
Loc: Campbell, CA
Does the code say the pipe has to be buried, or IF it is buried it has to adhere to 300.5.

If it is installed on the surface and it has protection on both sides higher than the height of the pipe, isn't that compliant? assuming a good judgment from the AHJ.
_________________________
Be kind to your neighbor, he knows where you live


Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >



ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals