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#191046 - 12/16/09 07:23 PM Detached garage bath  
derater  Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 179
Situation: Separate garage (by 150') on a residential lot, will be supplied with own service (meter). Would bathroom requirements be the same as for the house? For instance, would receptacle still need it's own feed? (separate from fan/light circuit)?


2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides

#191047 - 12/16/09 07:29 PM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: derater]  
HotLine1  Offline


Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,803
Brick, NJ USA
IMHO, it's a resi bath, and should be treated as such.

The bath can have 'everything' on a 20 amp, 120 volt circuit; recept/light, etc.



John

#191048 - 12/16/09 08:03 PM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: HotLine1]  
renosteinke  Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,316
Blue Collar Country
With all due respect to HotLine, I think this is one time to A) be absolutely honest, and B ) take advantage to 'the fine print.'

In Reno, the AHJ gets nervous when you start adding plumbing to a garage. Their motive is simple: some areas have a moratorium on "mother-in-law" apartments, and once that sewer is in, it's all too easy to convert the place into an illegal residence.

If there is the slightest chance that this will be converted into a residence, I'd wire it just like a residence.

Now, as to the 'fine print:" It's not a 'bathroom' if it doesn't have a sink. If the toilet alone is in a closet, with the sink mounted anywhere else - even on the wall next to the toilet room, it's not a bathroom. There's no need for there to be any receptacle at all.

I have seen a number of workshop conversions with just this arrangement. In those cases, the 'sink' is most ofter one of those huge laundry tubs. Often there will be a tiny point-of-use water heater that supplies a trickle of hot water.

Another 'trick' is to leave the top of any closets open, letting them get their light from the general shop lighting. This might also eliminate the need for any dedicated venting or windows.


#191049 - 12/16/09 09:26 PM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: renosteinke]  
HotLine1  Offline


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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,803
Brick, NJ USA
With all due respect to Reno, I did not want to delve into any zoning or building issues.

Here (NJ) we see a lot of cute attempts to create multi-family dwelling space; ie: basements, garages, etc.

The OP's description sounds like something that may be thought of as a place that may be occupied, but I don't believe that is his inquiry.



John

#191051 - 12/16/09 10:45 PM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: HotLine1]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,060
Estero,Fl,usa
Vote me with Hot John. It is a bathroom and you need a dedicated 20 but that can handle all the outlets in the bathroom (fan, light etc). Where this gets dodgy is if the fan/light has a 1kw toaster wire heater in it. That is still legal but you won't be drying your hair with the heater on.
If it is a 1.4kw it needs to be on a dedicated circuit but that is another issue.


Greg Fretwell

#191055 - 12/17/09 01:07 AM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: renosteinke]  
leland  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 853
Lowell area, Ma. USA
The OP used the phrase 'bathroom'.
I think there is only 1 definition in the code for this room.
So with out imagining/speculating,then the answer IMO is yes.

Based on the information and codes available to us at this time.


#191056 - 12/17/09 01:41 AM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: leland]  
frenchelectrican  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 939
Wi/ Paris France { France for ...
Ok let twist this a little senice you mention " apartment " conversion from garage space or other type of space now the other item it will show up is Laundry circuit { belive me it will happend one way or other }

Merci.
Marc


Pas de problme,il marche n'est-ce pas?"(No problem, it works doesn't it?)


#191057 - 12/17/09 01:45 AM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: leland]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,060
Estero,Fl,usa
Reno John is just pointing out that there needs to be basin to be called a bathroom but the basin only has to be in the "area" of the other qualifying fixture. The 20a receptacle has to be within 3' of that basin. If this is a "powder room" deal with a sink and a toilet it is easy. If the water closet is next to a "laundry sink" with a rough for a washer ... would you need two? wink

This NEC stuff is not for the timid

In real life, if this is a DIY project he probably has a 100a panel with dedicated 20s every few feet around the walls if what I see on the DIY groups are true. I keep asking myself, are they setting up a 10 man machine shop in these garages?


Greg Fretwell

#191058 - 12/17/09 01:46 AM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: gfretwell]  
gfretwell  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,060
Estero,Fl,usa
Marc beat me to the "laundry issue" wink


Greg Fretwell

#191063 - 12/17/09 02:24 AM Re: Detached garage bath [Re: gfretwell]  
frenchelectrican  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 939
Wi/ Paris France { France for ...
Originally Posted by gfretwell
Reno John is just pointing out that there needs to be basin to be called a bathroom but the basin only has to be in the "area" of the other qualifying fixture. The 20a receptacle has to be within 3' of that basin. If this is a "powder room" deal with a sink and a toilet it is easy. If the water closet is next to a "laundry sink" with a rough for a washer ... would you need two? wink

This NEC stuff is not for the timid

In real life, if this is a DIY project he probably has a 100a panel with dedicated 20s every few feet around the walls if what I see on the DIY groups are true. I keep asking myself, are they setting up a 10 man machine shop in these garages?


10 man machine shop now that is serious duty system to set up just watch out when someone asked for triphase supply espcally if they asked for 480 volts shocked

I have one like that simuair set up a very serious hobbist in the garage and above the loft area that is a apartment end up having 208Y120 400 amp service hook up for just for that set up.

Merci.
Marc


Pas de problme,il marche n'est-ce pas?"(No problem, it works doesn't it?)


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