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#175676 - 03/08/08 08:47 AM Electric shower heater..
Rewired Offline
Member

Registered: 01/01/06
Posts: 567
Loc: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Hey everyone!
This is just a little clip I found today and it was kind of alarming to me! I know these heaters are used in some places overseas, BUT the way this one is designed, and what they ask for makes me really awry about this product..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCZADrWCJvQ&feature=related

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#175678 - 03/08/08 09:36 AM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: Rewired]
Retired_Helper Offline
Member

Registered: 03/13/07
Posts: 167
Loc: Maine
I like the fact (not) that they give you a cord that has a 5-15P cap, but the pitchman tells you you'll need a 30 amp breaker. Are they suggesting that you replace a 15 or 20 amp breaker with a 30? Who has a 30 amp breaker feeding 10ga or 8ga wire on a circuit that includes 5-15R's? Or am I just old-fashioned and out of touch?

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#175680 - 03/08/08 10:37 AM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: Retired_Helper]
BigB Offline
Member

Registered: 03/31/04
Posts: 725
Loc: Tucson, AZ USA
Here is their site. Very misleading info, lets the average person think they can just plug it in. How many do you think will just go get a 30 amp breaker for their general lighting circuit? And what about that 5-15?

http://tankless-water-heaters.ecrater.com/product.php?pid=1450678

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#175682 - 03/08/08 12:01 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: Rewired]
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5299
Loc: Blue Collar Country
I have a few issues with that unit. One thing is certain: it never saw even the shadow cast by a UL office!

Others have raised this issues associated with the plug, and the size breaker required. Oddly enough, one MIGHT be able to argue that a dedicated circuit would fit under the 'exceptions' for using 25 amps as the ampacity of #12 - but if you're running a dedicated circuit, why not use the right plug?

Arguments about the plug pattern aside, those molded-on plugs seem to be somewhat limited, even when subjected to loads under 10 amps. The connections within them are often quite poor - especially after a few dozen flexes of the cord.

IF a hair dryer needs an 'immersion detector' in the plug, this gem really ought to have a GFI in its' plug. IMO.

The flow is consistent with currently mandated 'low flow' shower heads;

The attachment means bothers me. It appears that the unit cannot be installed, and have the shower head pointing in the right direction, without removing the stem (the bent pipe that usually supports the shower head), and installing an additional nipple.

I see mo means to adjust the temperature. If there is one, and it has anything to do with the connection box - well, that box is but a NEMA-1 design. Just perfect for use in the shower (NOT!)

My last worry is: Where to plug it in? I can't think of any shower I've ever used that had a receptacle anywhere near the shower head. Add to that the prevalence of shower doors (rather than curtains), and I see some real challenges to not resorting to the use of extension cords - another thing that has no place in the shower!

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#175688 - 03/08/08 02:53 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: renosteinke]
Rewired Offline
Member

Registered: 01/01/06
Posts: 567
Loc: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Actually if you look closely at it, the "junction box" looks like nothing more than a regular run of the mill pressure switch you would find on a well pump system, only this one is chromed!.. The leads coming out to the heater part look as just that.. a couple of wires, nothing more protecting them. ( the one in the video looks different than the one on the website BTW).
I figured everyone on the forum would have something to say about this piece of work...

"Fabrique en chine" comes to mind!


Edited by Rewired (03/08/08 02:58 PM)
Edit Reason: Still cant type worth beans!

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#175689 - 03/08/08 03:40 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: Rewired]
NORCAL Offline
Member

Registered: 09/25/02
Posts: 805
If I wanted to kill myself,electrocution would not be a prefered method.

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#175717 - 03/09/08 01:01 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: NORCAL]
Active 1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 684
Loc: Grayslake IL, USA
Who needs UL or sales tax? All you need is a website, email, and Palpal account. I would bet this company is not a legitimate business.

The information is confusing on the site.

Found this under FAQ:
http://tankless-water-heaters.ecrater.com/help.php
What about quality control?
All Marey products meet the high standards of UL, and are inspected for quality before they are shipped. Marey Heater Corp. has been in business for over 50 years and has one of the highest and most respected reputations in San Juan, PR.

San Jaun, Puerto Rico

I could not find the company listed at UL but it may have been me.
http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/template/LISEXT/1FRAME/index.htm

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#175722 - 03/09/08 01:54 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: Active 1]
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5299
Loc: Blue Collar Country
There are a few things with Marey's assertion that 'all their products meet the hight standards of UL.' Now is a good time to go into them.

First of all, UL does not have "high standards;" nor has UL anything to do with quality control. UL is in the sole business of, as their motto states, 'testing for public safety.' Not a single standard of theirs has the slightest thing to do with quality. We've all seen some pretty poorly made items that met every UL requirement.

Next, who says they meet any standards at all? MAREY does. Marey can claim what they want; absent the UL label on the product, there is NO UL listing for that product.
Indeed, many companies only apply the UL label to a part of their production. The UL listing applies only to those items that actually have the UL label. It matters not whether the unlabeled products are the same - or not.
I'm not surprised, either, that UL has never heard of "Marey." I seriously doubt that Marey actually makes anything; they are a marketing outfit. The UL tag will identify who actually made the item - either by name, or with a file number (used internally by UL).

Finally, every UL standard references other codes and standards. UL is not about to list a product that either directly violates those other codes, or whose instructions tell you to do so. Were such a product as this heater to be submitted to UL for evaluation, I expect that UL would have serious objections about the following points:
1) No GFCI in the plug;
2) The plug not being appropriate for the electrical requirements of the device;
3) The length and size of the cord;
4) The sealing of the connection box; and,
5) The instructions for use.

Apart from the NEC, other codes UL would reference would include the ASME's "Boiler and Pressure Vessel" code, and the requirements of the National Safety Foundation.

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#175727 - 03/09/08 04:44 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: renosteinke]
leland Offline
Member

Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Lowell area, Ma. USA
---

Installation:

30 Amps circuit breaker for the exclusive use of the heater. No special piping needed.
So easy to install, anyone can do it. Just unscrew your old shower head. Screw a straight nipple and the heater with Teflon tape and plug the heater into the wall plug (six feet away from the shower area).

Other installation details:

Install on metal pipes
Do not use extension cords for power ----

Well they are safety minded, 6' from the shower, no GFI needed.
Don't use an extension cord. Good advice.

So my next question is.... Who do you report it to?
1) you can sell anything. It's a legal product.
2) you just cannot install it in the USA.

Example: NH legal to purchase and posess fire works. Just don't light them off!

So they're smart, and the buyer is dumb.
Buyer beware.
I'm sure, some where in their paper work are all kinds of disclaimers re: USA installs etc.

How far do you take it without supporting the "big brother" mentality.

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#175795 - 03/11/08 02:53 PM Re: Electric shower heater.. [Re: leland]
Kenbo Offline
Member

Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 234
Loc: Scotland
I am sorry but even if electricaly it was safe I still would not buy it if it can only do this

"Average water temperature increase: 10 � 25 ┬║ F"

So if your water starts at 5C it will only reach 15C
The water would be warmer running off me than on me
_________________________
der Gro├čvater

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