ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#171577 - 11/30/07 08:59 PM Multi-Family Service Upgrade
Admin Offline

Administrator
Member
Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3417
Loc: NY, USA
Quote:
Attached are several code violations all for the same job. I was called out to “finish” the little bit of stuff that was left by the other contractor. When I told the property manager that we would have to redo pretty much the entire installation he sounded surprised.

The pictures should speak for themselves, there are so many code violations in each of them it is hard to encapsulate in the captioning. All of the new looking items were installed by the other electrician. I was trying to get a name from them so I could turn them in to the Contractors Board.

Roger Ervine















Top
2017 / 2014 NEC & Related Books and Study Guides
#171590 - 12/01/07 08:56 AM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Admin]
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
Member
Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5316
Loc: Blue Collar Country
Looks like a 'work in progress' ... one that was stopped before serious harm was done!

FWIW, here the PoCo would not let us use PVC pipe for an overhead feed.

I am puzzled by the extended time that the job is taking ... as suggested by the pictures. A job like this has but one way to do it - and that is, to kill all the power for the two or three days needed, and GET IT DONE. I've done such in sub-zero weather ... using a 'spider box' to keep the heat on and the fridge running.
Top
#171596 - 12/01/07 10:38 AM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Admin]
BigJohn Offline
Member
Registered: 03/06/04
Posts: 391
Loc: Boston, MA
In picture 6 that shows the PVC pipe running along the side of the house, what's the violation there? Is it that they went to the trouble to install their new entrance conductors over-top the old ones that should be getting demo'd? Or that they put their strut at an elbow?

And I haven't worked on many residential services, so I don't understand the violation in picture 7 either. I don't even understand the label: A 125A meter socket rated for 400 amps...? Is that 400 total and 125 per meter or something?

The rest of that, however, is obviously pretty nasty. It always rings alarm bells for me when I hear stories about electricians being called to "just finish a little bit" of someone else's work. There's usually a good reason that "someone else" isn't there anymore. Either they were fired for hack work or skipped out to avoid prosecution for hack work.

-John
Top
#171672 - 12/02/07 08:51 PM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: BigJohn]
Fidelity Electric Offline
Junior Member
Registered: 01/07/07
Posts: 6
Loc: Santee, California, USA
Originally Posted By BigJohn
In picture 6 that shows the PVC pipe running along the side of the house, what's the violation there? Is it that they went to the trouble to install their new entrance conductors over-top the old ones that should be getting demo'd? Or that they put their strut at an elbow?

And I haven't worked on many residential services, so I don't understand the violation in picture 7 either. I don't even understand the label: A 125A meter socket rated for 400 amps...? Is that 400 total and 125 per meter or something?

The rest of that, however, is obviously pretty nasty. It always rings alarm bells for me when I hear stories about electricians being called to "just finish a little bit" of someone else's work. There's usually a good reason that "someone else" isn't there anymore. Either they were fired for hack work or skipped out to avoid prosecution for hack work.

-John


Picture 6 shows a 2" conduit running to the 4 meter stack. The nameplate picture is for the four meter main buss (400A). By my calculations Table 310.15(B)(6) 400A copper is 400kcmil wire or a minimum 3 conductor feeder conduit size of 3" for the conduit(they used 2"). The conduit is coming from the junction box on the corner that is a nema 3R can mounted upside down. I am pretty sure without even checking that the can dimension is WAY undersized for that size wire, I would guess somewhere around a 24X24X6 without doing the calculation. One of the other pictures shows exposed PVC conduit running through the utilities gas piping which is a big no-no. As far as the PVC being legal overhead I don't think that is even allowed. I personally would have installed EMT or rigid for the installation.


Edited by Fidelity Electric (12/02/07 08:56 PM)
_________________________
You can learn a lot from a dummy...buckle up!!
Top
#171673 - 12/02/07 09:38 PM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Admin]
Lostazhell Offline
Member
Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 1428
Loc: Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
This place reminds me so much of A Few Things That Blew My Fuse , it's not even funny.... Ironically also from when I was working in San Diego. (Old Town) Even worse, this looks like some shotgun little cottages that I remember taking a look at someplace around University/Euclid Ave. area... I walked away from that one, then drove away alot faster!

Randy
Top
#171678 - 12/03/07 02:29 AM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Lostazhell]
walrus Offline
Member
Registered: 07/25/02
Posts: 680
Loc: Bangor Me. USA
They taped the wire nuts, what else can you ask for smile

Was some of that temporary?? while they completed the job??
Top
#171698 - 12/03/07 11:50 AM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: walrus]
WireNuts29 Offline
Member
Registered: 07/24/07
Posts: 85
Loc: Mass, U.S.A.
I want to see an over all pic of the entire wall. This is quite a bit of hackermanship. It's a shame cause thats not a cheap meterstack. apparently they forgot to pick up the how to change a service 1-2-3 book at home depot.
Top
#171717 - 12/03/07 10:53 PM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Admin]
hardwareguy Offline
Member
Registered: 06/15/07
Posts: 50
Loc: Texas
Wow....just wow! That's about all I can say for this fine example of how not to do it.

Did they actually expect this to pass?
Top
#171745 - 12/04/07 02:03 PM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Admin]
Elviscat Offline
Member
Registered: 08/13/05
Posts: 214
Loc: Seattle Washington USA
I have a problem with the opside-down 3R can, and BIG problems with the way they made up the temp

What I do not have a problem with is the size of the pipe in relation to the meter pack, the proper way to do this would be to perform a load calc on the building, and feed the meter pack based on that. It looks like they're missing a clamp on that PVC right near the 90 because the conduit both has to be on top of that gas line, and to get the proper depth for the meter pack, I would have used deep channel strut to avoid both of these issues.

my $0.02
-Will
Top
#171752 - 12/04/07 05:29 PM Re: Multi-Family Service Upgrade [Re: Elviscat]
wire_twister Offline
Member
Registered: 07/25/07
Posts: 265
Loc: Georgia USA
A 400 amp meter set needs a feeder capable of 400 amps. We can not control what someone might do in the future, therefore if it says 400 on the plate it should be able to carry it.
_________________________
Jimmy

Life is tough, Life is tougher when you are stupid
Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >

Member Spotlight
Member Since: 11/17/00
Posts: 2232
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box


Who's Online
0 registered (), 58 Guests and 8 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
 
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
 
Top Posters (30 Days)
Admin 49
HotLine1 43
gfretwell 18
Ruben Rocha 12
Trumpy 9
 
Newest Members
Freecrowder, clee512, Jdscott2005, FAIZAN, Regitest2

ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals