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#149080 - 06/27/03 11:09 AM Are ALL accidents avoidable?
SAFTENG Offline
Member

Registered: 09/04/01
Posts: 142
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
Another touchy topic, but hey I have never been accused of shying away from a good debate. I recently aquired a new client who had a serious accident at his/her facility. They hated the fact that one of their workers was killed; however their attitude towards lost-time accidents and OSHA recordables was very lax ("part of doing business"). The client is the parent company and I have been hired to do a "cultural investigation" the this plant and the company as a whole. What I am finding is very interesting; some quotes from interviews with all levels of the organization:

"Accidents are unfortunate events that are part of doing business in our line of work"

"Son I have been in this business, how old are you??? [my answer] longer than you have been alive and this type of work is impossible not to get hurt" (by the way, this veterna worker spent 15 minutes telling me about how he lost four fingers on his hand and was sort of proud of his dedication to his profession)

Does your company strive for an injury free workplace or just government compliance?

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#149081 - 06/27/03 02:25 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
ga.sparky56 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 582
Loc: young harris georgia usa
My personal belief is that when it's your time to go,no amount of safety gear or training will save you.

However there's no use to try and hurry it along!

An injury-free workplace Imho is impossible to achieve,but safety should be on everyones mind,striving is the key word,doing one's utmost to work safely.

Russell

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#149082 - 06/27/03 08:29 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
Trumpy Offline

Member

Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8540
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Russell,
I do quite a bit of maintenance and breakdown work for a local company that manufactures plastic products.
They have not had an accident there, in the whole 15 years that the factory has been going, mainly because they have a "culture" of regularly sitting down and discussing SAFETY.
No holds barred in these meeetings, in which everyone from the MD to the new boy have equal say(this company employs 300 people).
Bryan:
 Quote:
Accidents are unfortunate events that are part of doing business in our line of work"

This sort of attitude, in this day and age, is purely un-acceptable and the management of this workplace, need a good swift kick in the pants, for such a lax attitude to something that could cost the life of a worker.
_________________________
Let's face it, these days if you're not young, you're old - Red Green grin

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#149083 - 06/27/03 09:08 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
ga.sparky56 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 582
Loc: young harris georgia usa
Thats quite an impressive safety record Trumpy! A factory can be a tough place to be safe.

I've only worked in a couple of factories,(Lord willing I'll never have to work in another one,but thats a whole 'nother story)
and neither one was real safety oriented.


Russell

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#149084 - 06/28/03 03:54 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
sparky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
What is the debate about Bryan?

That some have an attitude when it comes to safety?

Gee, who is it that sets the tone here?

I await your reply

~S

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#149085 - 06/28/03 05:49 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
SAFTENG Offline
Member

Registered: 09/04/01
Posts: 142
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
Sparky,

it's quite simple, do you believe that all accidents are preventable? Most do not, and others do. Which side of the fence do you stand on and why do you stand on that side. I for one do believe that all accidents are preventable, it is just up to US to prevent them; and when i say US, I do not mean safety professionals alone! It takes the efforts of everyone.

Bryan

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#149086 - 06/28/03 07:56 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
ga.sparky56 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 582
Loc: young harris georgia usa
Not to jump in Brian,but are you saying that ALL workplace accidents can be prevented?

I'm not argueing,I'm with you on striving for safety.

I can remember an instance in which I believe an injury was unavoidable.
I was on a job once in which 2 painters were working on a scaffold,one of the men suffered a stroke,he started to fall,the other one grabbed him and in the process,fell against the railing and got a nasty cut on his forehead,several stitches as I remember.

Both men are still working the one having almost fully recovered from the stroke.

He had had a complete physical a month before this and been given a clean bill of health.

I realize this instance is a little off the wall,but my feelings are that as long as human frailties and human nature is in the equation,we'll always have mistakes and accidents.

But there's always room for improvement,and we can never stop striving.

Respectfully,Russell

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#149087 - 06/29/03 02:08 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
sparky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 5545
All the Ralph Naders and legislation we could muster won't make us accident free here, the proverbial 'better idiot' is carted away via ambulance every second here......

People are lulled into believing that Big Bro will keep them safe, and should they have a mishap they could be set for life with the aid of some 800 lawyer.

This cycle of legislation/litigation leaves one wondering of what personal responsibility actually exists.

Me?, I say the workers should be empowered to have a level of decisivness , based on parameters already in place.

You screw up, you don't win megabucks, pass go, or become a class action poster boy, you simply miss work to lick your wounds.

The future of 'safety' here is either going to be our choice (as it is daily with me btw) , or it will assume a police state doctrine with a populance litigating itself into the unemployment line.

That, Bryan, is putting tangability into the term 'everybody's effort'

edited to add.....
I would have told that ventura worker that my real dad has 10 & 10

[This message has been edited by sparky (edited 06-29-2003).]

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#149088 - 06/29/03 06:53 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
SAFTENG Offline
Member

Registered: 09/04/01
Posts: 142
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
Russell,

I would agree with your incident, but in my book that was not an "accident" as I define an accident. It was an unfornuate turn of events that occurred at work due to somones uncontrollable medical issues and then someone doing a great act of kindness in helping a fellow worker. I like to use Merriam-Webster's definition of "Accident" - an unfortunate event resulting especially from carelessness or ignorance. With using this defintion, i do not see your incident as an "accident" that i would say is controllable; although there are times I wish we could have some control over our employees eating, drinking, and exercise habits (JUST KIDDING HERE FOLKS!).

Bryan

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#149089 - 06/29/03 07:11 PM Re: Are ALL accidents avoidable?
ga.sparky56 Offline
Member

Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 582
Loc: young harris georgia usa
Oh Lordy Bryan,First you want me to keep all the loose emt and scrap wire picked up off the floor,then no pizza,salt or soft drinks,no cigarettes either I suppose.Exercise? You're no fun! LOL!

Russell

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