ECN Electrical Forum - Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

ECN Shout Chat
Top Posters(30 Days)
Admin 19
Recent Posts
fuse rejectors
by NORCAL. 03/29/17 01:44 AM
Old decora style outlets
by NORCAL. 03/29/17 01:41 AM
NFPA stuff
by gfretwell. 03/28/17 08:08 PM
Anyone hiring inspectors?
by HotLine1. 03/27/17 08:03 AM
ESA Arc flash course
by TheShockDoctors. 03/24/17 10:15 AM
New in the Gallery:
SE cable question
Popular Topics(Views)
231,878 Are you busy
166,758 Re: Forum
160,875 Need opinion
Who's Online Now
1 registered members (Admin), 85 guests, and 10 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4
#144587 - 01/03/06 10:50 PM RCA 45EY 2 record player  
cowabbi  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11
Buderim Queensland Australia
Hello all.....not to bore you all as I know this subject has come up many times before however never with a vintage record player as the topic.....
Could anyone please tell me if the above player will work on 50hz after I step the power down as we have 240v here in oz.
kind regards


Test Equipment:
Large Selection of Test Equipment For Electrical, HVAC, Test & Measurement
Large Selection of Test Equipment For Electrical, HVAC, Test & Measurement

#144588 - 01/03/06 11:29 PM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
SvenNYC  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,691
New York City
To put it simply, no.

Most likely the motor on a gramophone that old is AC and is dependent on the line frequency to hold its speed (like clock motors are).

A 110 volt 60 hertz AC motor will spin slower at 50 hertz even if it's running at the same voltage.

If this were a DC motor, as is the case with modern turntables, then it wouldn't matter because the AC from the line gets dropped and then rectified into DC.


#144589 - 01/04/06 01:06 AM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
yaktx  Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 288
Austin, Texas, USA
I had a turntable once that had a timing light built in. There was a screw that could adjust between 50 and 60Hz, with a little fine-tuning besides. You knew you had it properly adjusted when the little tic-marks on the rim of the turntable stayed put, rather than appear to turn slowly backwards, like wagon wheels in old Westerns.


#144590 - 01/04/06 01:26 AM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
cowabbi  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11
Buderim Queensland Australia
Hi there yes you are right it has an ac motor I can adjust the pully to get the right speed.....my worry is will it do the motor any damage and or the tube amp?


#144591 - 01/04/06 02:43 AM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
RODALCO  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 854
Titirangi, Akld, New Zealand
If you can get a 6/5 bigger pulley on the motor it should work ok with a little engineering.
Check that the motor doesn't get excessive warm but its probably a shaded pole motor which should give no problems while providing a little more torque.

The tube amp runs via transformer + rectifier on DC and should be no problem as long it gets the correct voltage.
From your post I think its 110-115 Volts on its primary side?

So a 240 V / 110 V stepdown transformer ± 250 VA should work fine.

Note: check what the total VA or Watts rating is of the turntable amp + motor.

Good luck ! [Linked Image]


The product of rotation, excitation and flux produces electricty.

#144592 - 01/04/06 07:19 AM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
pauluk  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
Quote
not to bore you all as I know this subject has come up many times before


We never get bored with stuff like this! [Linked Image]
Welcome aboard!

Most of those shaded-pole motors on turntables were intended for use on different frequency supplies anyway. The manufacturer just shipped them with the appropriate size pulley for the intended market.

I happened to be browsing through some old service booklets for Garrard decks from the early 1950s a few nights ago (the RC75 and RC80 series for anyone familiar with them).

As well as the expected 50 and 60Hz pulleys, Garrard also provided one for 40Hz supplies. So where in the early 1950s was running on 40Hz?


[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 01-04-2006).]


#144593 - 01/04/06 06:56 PM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
aussie240  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 223
Blue Mountains, NSW, Australia
I've got quite a few US televisions and radios and powering them here has never been an issue.
Firstly the live chassis stuff needs to be fed from an isolating transformer and not a cheaper autotransformer.
The frequency is a non issue except for synchronous motors. And then it's only in clocks, tape decks and gramophones where the slower speed is important.
I don't know the model of record player in question, but my guess is it's typical of US design throughout the 50's-60's with a shaded pole induction motor driving the turntable. The amplifier will be a live chassis design with one or two valves like 35W4 and 50EH5 or that sort of thing. It is not frequency sensitive and will in fact work on DC.I can't recall any US made portable gramophone or mantel radio with a transformer isolated supply and parallel heater valves.
With heater current being a max of 300mA (about 30W) and the motor probably drawing about 20W then a 60W transformer will do. The high tension supply for the valves won't be more than about 50mA and is scarcely signifigant in the overall current consumption.
In this situation the easiest way out is to get a 12-120V 60Hz inverter off Ebay for next to nothing and power your 60Hz appliance from that. The inverter is of course powered by a 240-12V(or 13.8V)DC supply of sufficient current rating.


#144594 - 01/04/06 07:02 PM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
aussie240  Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 223
Blue Mountains, NSW, Australia
Quote
So where in the early 1950s was running on 40Hz?

Parts of Western Australia were. In these areas, the generating plant had been obtained from South Africa. Some of the radio manufacturers in Australia did make 40 cycle models. The transformers in these sets are larger than the usual 50 cycle model. WA was also the last state to standardise on 240V in the 1980's.


#144595 - 01/04/06 08:48 PM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
Texas_Ranger  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,392
Vienna, Austria
Yup, my first big Dual brand record player had such a strobe light too. It made spotting the glitches in the electronic drive control fairly easy [Linked Image] Though the speed variations were audible too.


#144596 - 01/05/06 02:44 AM Re: RCA 45EY 2 record player  
cowabbi  Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11
Buderim Queensland Australia
Thanx aussie 240 u r quite right the player has a complement of 3 valves 12AV6 35W4 50C5....am I not just better off buying a good stepdown instead of an inverter, as the other kind folks have said most of these motors run on both 50 or 60hz a change of pulley was required is all...what say you
kind regards


Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4

Member Spotlight
Joe Tedesco
Joe Tedesco
Boston, Massachusetts USA
Posts: 2,749
Joined: October 2000
Show All Member Profiles 
Featured:

2017 NEC and Related
2017 NEC
Now Available!

Shout Box
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.017s Queries: 15 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8199 MB (Peak: 0.9954 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-03-30 16:40:15 UTC