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#144285 - 11/05/05 05:17 PM Yellow?
Trumpy Offline

Member

Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8540
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Guys,
Since the 'B' Phase colour here has been changed from Yellow to White (in accordance with International convention, so I'm told), are you still allowed to use Yellow as a Phase colouring, if you have white control wires inside the same enclosure?.
These are all conduit wires, not cables in this enclosure.
Or has the ability to use yellow gone with any new stuff?.
Your opinions please?.
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#144286 - 11/06/05 12:58 AM Re: Yellow?
Wolfgang Offline
Member

Registered: 09/25/05
Posts: 154
Loc: the very West of Germany
Hi Trumpy,

just curious about what "International" means in a down under context?

In Europe white is obsolete.
Except for switch panel wiring where it is often used for the earthed (mostly negative) side of 24 VDC control voltage

In North America white is the "grounded conductor".

Here in Germany the way of replacing colour codes has more or less been done in a way that
1. a new colour code was defined
2. a new colour was produced and sold
3. electricians had a period of some months to years to end up the "old" material they stored
4. the new code became mandatory

But no idea about Australasia (probably except for Tahiti and New Caledonia). Only a certain curiosity which is the reason why I'm reading here.

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#144287 - 11/06/05 01:18 AM Re: Yellow?
marcspages Offline
Member

Registered: 10/15/04
Posts: 49
Loc: London, UK
In South Africa the colours are (or at least were whhen I left 6 years ago) Red-Whit-Blue. The White would fade in the sun and become yellow. Here in the UK (before we moved to the mad colours of now), the Yellow would fade and look like dirty white. Looks like a no-win situation!

However, that is off the subject! The rule I remember was each and every wire in a cabinet must be definable by its colour as to its use e.g. all white wires were control, all red were power, etc. If you take this across to your situation I believe, seeing as white is already defined as control, yellow should continue as your phase colour.

But please don't take this as law (simply because my experience is law diametrically opposes common sense!).

M.

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#144288 - 11/06/05 06:37 AM Re: Yellow?
pauluk Offline
Member

Registered: 08/11/01
Posts: 7693
Loc: Norfolk, England
 Quote:
Since the 'B' Phase colour here has been changed from Yellow to White (in accordance with International convention, so I'm told),


I'm not sure what international convention that would be.

In the U.K. red/white/blue was the standard up until 1964, as which point B-phase changed to yellow, which is what it is today (until the old colors are fully displaced in a few months by "that" color code).

So far as I'm aware, RYB (or RWB) has only ever really been a standard in British/Commonwealth countries, or those so influenced.

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#144289 - 11/06/05 10:48 AM Re: Yellow?
Wolfgang Offline
Member

Registered: 09/25/05
Posts: 154
Loc: the very West of Germany
And "A,B,C" phase will be displaced by L1 thru L3 ?
I suppose so, as we lost our R S T Mp SL long ago.

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#144290 - 11/08/05 02:02 AM Re: Yellow?
kiwi Offline
Member

Registered: 12/04/04
Posts: 347
Loc: christchurch new zealand
I lament the loss of our old Yellow ( B ) phase too Trumpy. Can anyone in our part of the world explain why we had to do this ?

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#144291 - 11/08/05 05:57 AM Re: Yellow?
pauluk Offline
Member

Registered: 08/11/01
Posts: 7693
Loc: Norfolk, England
 Quote:
we lost our R S T Mp SL long ago.


I remember the old Continental RST, but what is Mp and SL? Neutral and ground?

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#144292 - 11/08/05 06:15 AM Re: Yellow?
C-H Offline

Member

Registered: 09/17/02
Posts: 1508
Loc: Stockholm, Sweden
Mittelpunkt und Schutzleiter?

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#144293 - 11/08/05 10:10 AM Re: Yellow?
Texas_Ranger Offline
Member

Registered: 12/17/01
Posts: 2343
Loc: Vienna, Austria
Yup, you're both right. Mp is the center point conductor (center point = star point), Schutzleiter simply means protectiion conductor = PE.
Something real funny about German terminology though... "Schutzerde" used to be a real common term for PE. Nowadays German sparkies (and our Austrian teacher s as well) insist on the use of "PE" or "Schutzleiter" because in their opinion the old term isn't correct - it's referring to earth and in a TN-C-S system the PE isn't necessarily locally grounded so they want to avoid confusion by only using the term PE... whcih unfortunately stands for Protective Earth, meaning _word by word_ exactly the same as the German "Schutzerde"... those harmonization preachers don't seem to notice that!

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#144294 - 11/08/05 01:45 PM Re: Yellow?
Wolfgang Offline
Member

Registered: 09/25/05
Posts: 154
Loc: the very West of Germany
Mittelpunktsleiter or "center point conductor" was also used for DC in a way American 2 phase systems are wired. So it does not mean Star point in every case. It could be a center tap of one lonely coil also.

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