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#142541 - 02/01/05 04:31 PM Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
SWB  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3
New Albany, Indiana, USA
I'm in the US, but I need to install a German ceiling (pendant) light made by Oligo . This is for a residential application. I'm curious to know how such lights are typically installed in Germany.

In the US, residential ceiling lights are typically mounted to a standard ceiling box. These come in metal or plastic and are usually either round or octagonal. Here's a couple of examples:

<IMG SRC=\"http://www.smugmug.com/photos/15183708-S.jpg\"> <IMG SRC=\"http://www.smugmug.com/photos/15183709-S.jpg\">

Here's a metal octagon box installed (the yucky brown ring is a result of cigarette smoke):

<IMG SRC=\"http://www.smugmug.com/photos/15181861-S.jpg\">

These boxes are typically 75 or 100 mm wide and provide two threaded holes either 89 or 70 mm apart. Lighting fixtures typically screw directly to these holes and have a cover to hide the box.

The German fixture I have looks like this:

<IMG SRC=\"http://www.smugmug.com/photos/15181862-S.jpg\"> <IMG SRC=\"http://www.smugmug.com/photos/15181860-S.jpg\">

It has a bracket with holes spaced 45 mm apart that looks like it's intended to be surface-mounted to the ceiling. The light then hangs from the bracket via two screws on the side. The cylindrical cover has a diameter of 70 mm and is about 23 mm deep, providing a volume of about 88 cm³.

I can make an adapter plate without too much trouble to fit this light to a US ceiling box, but I'm curious to know how this would be installed in Germany. Are there ceiling boxes over there, or does the wire just come through a small hole in the ceiling? Would the connections be done inside the cover on the light (doesn't seem like there's much room for that), or would they be done inside the ceiling?

Thanks!
Steve


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#142542 - 02/01/05 04:45 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
Trumpy  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,211
SI,New Zealand
Hi there Steve,
Welcome to ECN!. [Linked Image]
By the looks of the bracket on your German light fitting, there is no need for a box above the fitting.
That bracket, screws directly to a timber joist, using wood screws and then the top is attached by the set screws on each side.
Personally I'd use at least 3 screws and make sure that they go into substantial timber in the ceiling. [Linked Image]

Yes the connections are made in the top part of the fitting, as un-believable as that sounds.
What voltage is this fitting?.
Hope that this is of some help.

Mike :}



[This message has been edited by Trumpy (edited 02-04-2005).]


Let's face it, these days if you're not young, you're old - Red Green grin

#142543 - 02/02/05 03:54 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
djk  Offline
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,237
Ireland
They're usually not boxed here in Ireland either... I think they should move towards a standard plug-in fitting though!


#142544 - 02/02/05 05:16 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
Trumpy  Offline


Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 8,211
SI,New Zealand
Hi Dave,
Quote
I think they should move towards a standard plug-in fitting though!

Now there is a flash idea that I could agree with!. [Linked Image]
It would make the fitting of sometimes heavy light fittings a lot easier and faster and also removing them for repairs/cleaning. [Linked Image]


Let's face it, these days if you're not young, you're old - Red Green grin

#142545 - 02/02/05 06:44 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
pauluk  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,520
Norfolk, England
Hi SWB, and welcome to the forum.

That type of fixture is also quite common in Britain now as well. The connections would typically be made inside the fixture housing using "choc blocks," like these:

[Linked Image]

Quote
I think they should move towards a standard plug-in fitting though!


Well, you can get plug-in connectors for simple pendanta and for fancier hanging fixtures:

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASPCR2000.html
http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LDMC11A.html


#142546 - 02/02/05 09:22 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
aland  Offline
Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 186
United Kingdom
Sparkys nightmare connecting light fittings, most of the fittings end up as a deviation to BS 7671 when connected up. Paul the Mystro accessory in your link is the best solution but can be a fiddle to addapt. Have to admit the US solution appears best with a good strong metal box with tapped holes. Why lighting manufacturers can not standardise a fixing plate I will never understand.


#142547 - 02/03/05 04:12 AM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
C-H  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,497
Stockholm, Sweden
The Swedish solution is - as I think a lot of you here know by now [Linked Image] - either a round box with a hook and a small socket outlet or simply a hook and a small trailing socket. (The box will support a maximum of 15 kg / 33 lbs.) This would have worked well if the manufacturers of lights didn't insist on making the hooks and covers in only two versions: bad and worse.


#142548 - 02/03/05 02:56 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
SWB  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3
New Albany, Indiana, USA
Thanks, everyone! I've been lurking around here for awhile, and I've found the non-US forum particularly interesting and enlightening. Somebody should write a book comparing and detailing the electrical systems in use throughout the world.
Quote
the connections are made in the top part of the fitting, as un-believable as that sounds. What voltage is this fitting?

230 V, which probably explains the small wiring space – less current and smaller, easier-to-manage wires than our 120 V requires.
Quote
connections would typically be made inside the fixture housing using "choc blocks"

Yep, it even came with one of those, as well as a couple of 230-V QT-DE 11/12 (78 mm) bulbs. If anybody wants the bulbs, you're welcome to them. [Linked Image]

Steve


#142549 - 02/03/05 05:25 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
SvenNYC  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,691
New York City
Are the bulbs regular incandescents that screw in?

If they use the "French Candelabra" (a size between Intermediate and Candelabra bases), there is a reducer available that just screws onto the bulbs and enables regular candelabra/night light bulbs to be used with these European sockets.


#142550 - 02/03/05 05:53 PM Re: Standard German ceiling light mounting?  
SWB  Offline
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3
New Albany, Indiana, USA
They're 78-mm, double-ended, T3 halogen bulbs:

[Linked Image]

[This message has been edited by SWB (edited 02-03-2005).]


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