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#135219 - 12/27/02 03:18 PM England, GB, or UK?
pauluk Offline
Member
Registered: 08/11/01
Posts: 7520
Loc: Norfolk, England
I've had a couple of queries about the varying use of the names England, Great Britain, U.K. etc., so I thought a quick summary of the differences might be in order.

Here's an outline map of the British Isles:



The larger land mass to the east is known as Great Britain. It comprises three entities: England (yellow), Wales (green), and Scotland (red). England & Wales were joined way back in 1284, and the United Kingdom was formed by a union with Scotland in 1707.

The smaller land mass to the west is Ireland, which also became part of the U.K. in 1801, making the full official name of the country "The United Kingdom of Great Britain & Ireland."

After many years of unrest with British rule there was an uprising (sound familiar, guys? ), and Ireland was divided up in 1921. Six counties in the north (in blue) remained part of the U.K. and became known as Northern Ireland, the official title of the U.K. then becoming "The United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland."

The other 26 counties in Ireland became an independent country, first as the Irish Free State, then Eire, then finally in 1949 the Republic of Ireland.

There are also some small islands which are British territory but which are not part of the U.K. -- These are the Isle of Mann (between GB and Ireland but not shown on this map) and the Channel Island jurisdictions of Jersey and Guernsey (these islands are actually closer to France than to Britain).

Hope this helps sort out any confusion!


[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 12-27-2002).]

{ My edits on 11/9/2003 due to moved images }


[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 11-09-2003).]
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#135220 - 12/27/02 04:21 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
Trainwire Offline
Member
Registered: 03/15/02
Posts: 360
Loc: Strasburg,PA,USA
Thanks Paul, that helps alot!

I know a lady from Wales, that smacks me everytime I say she's from England.

The only problem is that over here, a jersey is something you wear to play sports, and a Gurnsey is a barn!

Tw
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#135221 - 12/27/02 04:27 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
David UK Offline
Member
Registered: 10/03/02
Posts: 134
Loc: Inverness, Scotland
People in the red section get seriously pissed off when England is used instead of the UK or Great Britain!
Just like Canadians being classed as Americans or vice versa.
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#135222 - 12/28/02 04:24 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
Trumpy Offline


Member
Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8211
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Paul,
We were always taught at school, to call the UK, the British Isles, what gives??.
_________________________
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#135223 - 12/28/02 05:24 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
Hutch Offline
Member
Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 381
Loc: South Oxfordshire, UK
Trumpy,

Technically the British Isles comprises the whole of the map that Paul has posted. Any objections to this inclusive term from the tan coloured part of the map may be balanced by the fact that the whole of the water between the two large islands is called the Irish Sea.
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#135224 - 12/29/02 03:44 AM Re: England, GB, or UK?
pauluk Offline
Member
Registered: 08/11/01
Posts: 7520
Loc: Norfolk, England
I'm not sure when the term "British Isles" came into common use, but my guess would be that it became accepted sometime after 1801 (and obviously its use pre-dates the division of Ireland in 1921). Although the tan part of the map hasn't been British for decades, the term was probably so ingrained in common usage by then that people just continued using it.

I tend to think of "British Isles" as a mere geographical term, just as North America refers not only to the U.S.A. but also includes Canada and Mexico.

The current official names are:

United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland

-and-

Republic of Ireland / Poblacht na h'Eireann

(The R.o.I. is officially bilingual.)


[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 12-29-2002).]
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#135225 - 01/02/03 10:03 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
Trumpy Offline


Member
Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8211
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Thankfully, Paul,
I was taught at school, before any of this PC rubbish was brought in, would hate to go back to school now!, I am not sure what they call you guys over there now, it scares me to think of the name!!.
_________________________
Let's face it, these days if you're not young, you're old - Red Green grin
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#135226 - 01/03/03 02:33 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
djk Offline
Member
Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 1237
Loc: Ireland
I'd like to propose one that only angers & upsets tory euro-sceptics, extreme irish republicans and the right wing generally.

The Northwestern European Isles (NEI) we could even add Iceland and Fero Islands

As it stands:

British Isles - Geographic Identity

anything else is a political / national identity.

Spain has a similar situation to the UK with various national identities all stuck together under one banner "Spain".

(Republic of Ireland excluded from that comparision)
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#135227 - 01/04/03 12:42 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
pauluk Offline
Member
Registered: 08/11/01
Posts: 7520
Loc: Norfolk, England
Just for the record, here are the appropriate flags.

England (Cross of St. George):



Scotland (Cross of St. Andrew):




These were overlaid to form the original U.K. flag:




Cross of St. Patrick:



was added to the British flag when Ireland became part of the U.K., thus:




[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 11-09-2003).]
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#135228 - 01/04/03 12:46 PM Re: England, GB, or UK?
pauluk Offline
Member
Registered: 08/11/01
Posts: 7520
Loc: Norfolk, England
Then there's the flag adopted for Northern Ireland:




And that for Wales (Yes, that's a dragon!):



Finally, the flag of the independent Republic of Ireland:



There are others for Jersey, Guernsey, and the Isle of Man.


[This message has been edited by pauluk (edited 11-09-2003).]
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