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#124621 - 11/12/06 07:18 AM Pics from Shockme77
Trumpy Offline


Member
Registered: 07/05/02
Posts: 8211
Loc: SI,New Zealand
Photos and info submitted by Shockme77:
Quote:
I'm just about done trimming-out a house and I thought
I'd share some pics of the work I've done. I've never before sent in pictures for the discussion forum and I understand that I'm opening myself up to criticism, so fire-away!. This single-family dwelling is in Scotch
Plains, New Jersey and hasn't been sold yet. Just
slightly less than 5k SQ', and the asking price is $1.4.














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#124622 - 11/12/06 07:46 AM Re: Pics from Shockme77
Jim M Offline
Member
Registered: 08/10/01
Posts: 457
Loc: Chestertown, MD, USA
Doesn't look like the builder cared enough to option out the place with a structured wiring system cabinet. Also doesn't look like enough branch circuits.

I think I would have used some of the KO's in the TJIs to run my home runs through.
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#124623 - 11/12/06 08:00 AM Re: Pics from Shockme77
SteveFehr Offline
Member
Registered: 03/19/05
Posts: 1195
Loc: Chesapeake, VA
Your AHJ lets you bundle that many Romex together for long runs without derating?
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#124624 - 11/12/06 09:33 AM Re: Pics from Shockme77
Alan Nadon Offline
Member
Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 399
Loc: Elkhart, IN. USA
Violation.
Check Section 334.15(C)
Otherwise it would pass inspection.
Alan--
One solution would be to drop the wires, install 1X2 or other running boards, and put the wires back up. You should check with the manufacturer of the T joist since they do not like to have things nailed or screwed to the bottom edge.
A--

[This message has been edited by Alan Nadon (edited 11-12-2006).]

[This message has been edited by Alan Nadon (edited 11-12-2006).]
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Alan--
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#124625 - 11/12/06 09:44 AM Re: Pics from Shockme77
renosteinke Offline
Cat Servant
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Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 5316
Loc: Blue Collar Country
It's only a bundle if you fail to "maintain spacing." The plastic trees he used to support the romex do maintain spacing between the wires. Indeed, it looks like he exceeded code requirements for support.

Since he's using proper hangers, I'm not sure what the use of running boards would accomplish; there does not appear to be any significant 'droop' to the cables. Perhaps this will need to be addressed in the next code cycle?

The KO's in the joists NEVE line up. Nor would using them for support -in lieu of runing boards- support the cables any better than they already are supported.

Awfully nice that the gutter crew saw fit to go around the service drop; usuallym they try to pry it out from the wall!


The only 'nit' I see to pick at is the lack of working space in front of one of the air conditioner disconnects.
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#124626 - 11/12/06 12:57 PM Re: Pics from Shockme77
LarryC Offline
Member
Registered: 07/05/04
Posts: 780
Loc: Winchester, NH, US
Where is the outlet for the air conditioning condensors?

Do you have a ground rod under the meter?

Does the central steel beam need to be bonded?

Larry C
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#124627 - 11/12/06 01:07 PM Re: Pics from Shockme77
iwire Offline
Moderator
Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4391
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
No bundling derating issue to even consider if there are less than 9 current carrying conductors in either of those bundles if indeed the AHJ feels they are bundles.

(Mine would)
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#124628 - 11/12/06 02:15 PM Re: Pics from Shockme77
ShockMe77 Offline
Member
Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 821
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
Quote:
Also doesn't look like enough branch circuits.


I installed a 125 AMP sub panel in the 2nd floor laundry room. It feeds 5 bedrooms, 1 future bedroom, 2 full baths, master bathroom jacuzzi (20 amp), 2 furnaces, and all 2nd floor and attic lighting. It is full at 20 full size breakers but has the capacity for 40 twins.

Quote:
One solution would be to drop the wires, install 1X2 or other running boards, and put the wires back up.


That's what I did originally. The boss didn't like it that way and had me change it to how it is now.

Quote:
Awfully nice that the gutter crew saw fit to go around the service drop; usuallym they try to pry it out from the wall!


Fortuneatly, I got to do the service before the gutters were installed.

Quote:
Where is the outlet for the air conditioning condensors?
Do you have a ground rod under the meter?

Does the central steel beam need to be bonded?


The 210.63 requirement is within 25' of the equipment but can't be seen in the picture. It's there though.

No ground rod is needed. The Ufer was available and was used. The copper water pipes are bonded by #4 cu and the water heater is jumped out from hot to cold.

Quote:
No bundling derating issue to even consider if there are less than 9 current carrying conductors in either of those bundles if indeed the AHJ feels they are bundles.


The AHJ had no issues with bundling. He asked me a question about article 250.148 during the rough inspection and was impressed that I knew what he was talking about.

Not sure when the final inspection will be though.
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#124629 - 11/13/06 08:13 AM Re: Pics from Shockme77
Alan Nadon Offline
Member
Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 399
Loc: Elkhart, IN. USA
Shock, and all,
NEC 334.15(C) In Unfinished Basements. Where cable is run at angles with joist in ubfinished basements , ...2 #6 or 3 #8 directly to lower edge....
Smaller cables SHALL be run either through bored holes in joist or on running boards.
Below the joist NM cable is a violation.
It isn't just support but, protection. People used to use the wires as clothes line and hang wet clothes from wire hangers from the conductors. A real treat when they had K&T wiring.
Alan--
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Alan--
If it was easy, anyone could do it.
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#124630 - 11/13/06 01:38 PM Re: Pics from Shockme77
ShockMe77 Offline
Member
Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 821
Loc: Rahway, New Jersey
Alan, I interpret article 334.15(C) the same way you do. In fact, that is how I originally installed the cables, on a running board until I was told by the builder AND my boss to do it the way you see it is now. Most inspectors around here are ok with this install as long as it can be boxed-out later if a sheetrock ceiling is installed instead of a suspended ceiling.
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