The Electrical Contractor Network

ECN Electrical Forum
Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Books, Tools and Test Equipment for Electrical and Construction Trades

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#118160 - 08/13/04 10:42 AM Covering Service Riser
Webmaster Offline

Administrator
Member

Registered: 10/07/00
Posts: 3142
Loc: NY, USA
 Quote:
Covering the service riser with siding creates a heat trap. The additional heat can cause premature failure and/or fire. Is there a specific Code reference prohibiting this?

- kduke



Top
Tools for Electricians:
#118161 - 08/13/04 10:47 AM Re: Covering Service Riser
Lostazhell Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 1248
Loc: Bakersfield, CA (Originally Or...
Is this any different than if the riser was in the wall with a semi-flush installation?

-Randy

Top
#118162 - 08/14/04 08:18 AM Re: Covering Service Riser
NJwirenut Offline
Member

Registered: 09/15/01
Posts: 816
Loc: Bergen County, NJ
Looks like a great way to hide evidence of power theft to me. Does the local POCO actually allow this kind of thing?

Top
#118163 - 08/14/04 09:08 AM Re: Covering Service Riser
PCBelarge Offline
Member

Registered: 06/08/03
Posts: 657
Loc: Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
I believe that California permits Rigid within the walls, in NY the Service Entrance cannot be installed within the wall cavity.
One thing I do see in my travels is some SE Cable that has been enclosed by siding or some other fashion. I wonder just how dangerous this may be? Is it not permitted by the NEC?

Pierre
_________________________
Pierre Belarge

Top
#118164 - 08/14/04 09:47 AM Re: Covering Service Riser
iwire Offline
Moderator

Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4343
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
I do not agree that this is a 'heat trap' conduits are often in walls with insulation.

That aside in this area (New England) this would not be allowed as this would be considered as service conductors "inside" the building and a violation of 230.70(A)(1).

Randy not putting down what is allowed in CA but that method (semi flush services) is, as far as I know only acceptable in CA.

It was an eye opener when Bill A. showed me some pictures of CA services, as a NY native he was also surprised by that method.

Bob
_________________________
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts

Top
#118165 - 08/14/04 08:49 PM Re: Covering Service Riser
CTwireman Offline
Member

Registered: 02/07/02
Posts: 839
Loc: Connecticut, USA
Bob,

Other Western states have services very similar, if not identical, to California's, including Utah, Nevada, and Arizona.

Being a New Englander myself, that method of doing the service really surprised me too. I was a bit leery of having the panel and all the breakers outdoors, to say the least. But, there are millions of homes out there done that way, so it can't be all that bad! It saves quite a bit of time over our way of doing things, that's for sure.

Pierre,

I took these pics when I visited CA and as you can see from the second pic, PVC is very commonly used within the wall for the riser into the panel.

Peter
_________________________
Peter

Top
#118166 - 08/14/04 09:40 PM Re: Covering Service Riser
iwire Offline
Moderator

Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4343
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
Peter I am not talking about the breakers being outside you can find that anywhere.

The thing that I find unusual is the service riser pipe runs inside the wall cavity to a main panel meter combo that is also inside the wall cavity.

Obviously it works good for them but how is it not a NEC violation?

Don't try this in our area it will not pass.
_________________________
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician
Massachusetts

Top
#118167 - 08/14/04 10:03 PM Re: Covering Service Riser
John Steinke Offline
Member

Registered: 04/03/01
Posts: 509
Loc: Reno,Nv., USA
I don't have a problem with this. As was pointed out, risers are frequently places within wall cavities. They almost always pass throgh the attic space for part of their run. On older homes, the meter/fuse box is often set into a cabinet that was built into the wall at the time of construction; the riser then is in the wall.

On the brighter side, too often I see exposed risers with questionable attachment to the side of the building- as well as other things attached to them!

FWIW, a subdivision around here is rewuiring services to be flush with the face of the wall; everything is inside the wall.

They want to hide the pipe, I say OK.

Top
#118168 - 08/15/04 11:42 AM Re: Covering Service Riser
PCBelarge Offline
Member

Registered: 06/08/03
Posts: 657
Loc: Dobbs Ferry, NY, USA
I am certainly not an expert in this method. I saw this on a post awhile back, and it was stated that it had to be rigid, with no more than 6 inches of conduit run horizontally.

I do not like the idea of unprotected service entrance conductor of any chapter 3 method run inside the wall cavity. That is just my opinion.

"it is hard to teach old dogs new tricks"
_________________________
Pierre Belarge

Top
#118169 - 08/15/04 02:07 PM Re: Covering Service Riser
electure Offline

Member

Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4226
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
Up until ECN, I thought that everybody did services like we do here in California
The idea of SE Cable run on the exterior of a building I thought laughable at best, much like a piece of "Giant Romex".

It all depends on what you're accustomed to, and what your climate dictates.


I think the siding issue here is akin to saying conduit can't be run inside a wall. If it's going to cause a fire, then there's much bigger problems than a piece of siding...S

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >



ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals