The Electrical Contractor Network

ECN Electrical Forum
Discussion Forums for Electricians, Inspectors and Related Professionals

Books, Tools and Test Equipment for Electrical and Construction Trades

Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#116275 - 03/25/04 04:45 AM It's right there
electure Offline


Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4226
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
It's amazing how many mistakes can be avoided by simply looking beyond one's nose.

Does anybody else have trouble with installers that simply don't pay any attention, and just "put it in"?...S

Tools for Electricians:
#116276 - 03/25/04 06:05 AM Re: It's right there
Ryan_J Offline

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1355
Loc: West Jordan, Utah, USA
Spooky stuff.....Its scary what we see sometimes.
Ryan Jackson,
Salt Lake City

#116277 - 03/25/04 06:46 AM Re: It's right there
winnie Offline

Registered: 09/15/03
Posts: 652
Loc: boston, ma

Could you elaborate on the story here?

I don't see an equipment ground conductor, and I do see the empty lugs, but I don't see enough of the box to know the the EGC is properly connected someplace else. Also, the empty lugs that I do see appear to be insulated from tbe box, and are presumably for a grounded conductor rather than the ground conductor.

Is the tape on the rightmost conductor yellow or white??? If white, I thought that the grounded conductor _could_ be switched if it was switched at the same time as the hots....


#116278 - 03/25/04 10:33 AM Re: It's right there
n1ist Offline

Registered: 02/13/02
Posts: 176
Loc: Malden MA
Is the cover listing 240V/225A referring to the 480V/80A breaker in the box? Does the "internal fuses" refer to the breaker above? That's not a fuse...

The color coding of brn/org/yel does jibe with the 480V breaker. The right wire is probably phase C (yel), not neutral (wht).

#116279 - 03/25/04 11:22 AM Re: It's right there
Jim M Offline

Registered: 08/10/01
Posts: 453
Loc: Chestertown, MD, USA
The issue with the first photo is it is being used above its' voltage rating. The color code is for 277/480 3 phase and the label says 240 volts. Does the cover? look like a piece of drywall?

#116280 - 03/25/04 01:10 PM Re: It's right there
iwire Offline

Registered: 01/05/03
Posts: 4343
Loc: North Attleboro, MA USA
Electure you sure make it tough.

I am not sure the whole story is with picture one is.

It looks like someone installed a 480 VAC breaker in a 240 volt enclosure.

Just a note here there is no color code, brown orange yellow can be 208 volt.

With my psychic powers I will guess the second picture is a NEMA 3R disconnect mounted on a HVAC unit. For extra points I will say a unit made by Trane.

This disconnect is mounted on top of a cover that needs to be opened to access fuses inside the unit.
Bob Badger
Construction & Maintenance Electrician

#116281 - 03/25/04 04:20 PM Re: It's right there
electure Offline


Registered: 12/24/00
Posts: 4226
Loc: Fullerton, CA USA
Sorry, I didn't mean to cause any confusion.
I'll explain.
Top picture = 480V 3Ø, no neutral. EGC is 1-1/4" EMT into field cut KO's (not concentrics).
The enclosure is only rated for 240V, as marked on the cover shown.

The other picture, yes he mounted it right on the panel that must remain removeable.

My "real" question was if many of you run into things like this on a regular basis, or is it just me?
The installers in both of these pictures had to look directly at the of respective labels, but apparently didn't see what was right in front of their eyes.
(Both installers read & speak English) ...S

[This message has been edited by electure (edited 03-25-2004).]

#116282 - 03/25/04 07:03 PM Re: It's right there
HotLine1 Offline


Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 6792
Loc: Brick, NJ USA
Recently (doing private insp) came on a 250 volt, 200 amp (fused) disc as the primary OCP for a 480-120/208 xfr. YES it had 200 amp, 250 volt fuses, and YES it was connected to a 480 volt, 225 amp CB in the building switchboard.

Looking at the secondary....flex to a 6x6..tap to a 200 amp MCB panel (120/208) & tap to 200 amp fused disc for compressor rack. No Grd on XO, or anyplace else, except the piece of #6 ty-wrapped outside the flex, & wrapped around the flex conn screws.

A bomb waiting to blow. I guess the 'terrorists' are masquerading as 'lectricians ??? Osama Power????


#116283 - 03/25/04 07:49 PM Re: It's right there
Jps1006 Offline

Registered: 01/22/04
Posts: 609
Loc: Northern IL
we have to charge extra if you want us to think AND work at the same time.

#116284 - 03/25/04 10:26 PM Re: It's right there
Bjarney Offline

Registered: 04/10/02
Posts: 2561
Loc: West-Southern Inner-Northeast ...

OT a little... Didn't Challenger buy out Zinsco at one time?

[This message has been edited by Bjarney (edited 03-26-2004).]


ECN Electrical Forums - sponsored by Electrical Contractor Network - Electrical and Code Related Discussion for Electrical Contractors, Electricians, Inspectors, Instructors, Engineers and other related Professionals